Aging a stock head
- Thread starter John Long
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Joe Hudson
A Fixture
Hey John,
I used Duro and AVES. What I did was add more to the brow and shaved down the cheeks and rebuilt them. I also added some to the chin and then resculpted the nose. Sorry if this is vague. What exactly are you wanting to do and maybe I can help
Joe
I used Duro and AVES. What I did was add more to the brow and shaved down the cheeks and rebuilt them. I also added some to the chin and then resculpted the nose. Sorry if this is vague. What exactly are you wanting to do and maybe I can help
Joe
fsdesimone
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2003
- Messages
- 387
I'd be curious to hear the responses to this as well, since I'm attempting to do the same thing and am unhappy with the results so far.
Francesca
Francesca
LCoote
A Fixture
hey John, what about fleshing out the cheeks so the cheek bones are not so well defined, adding wrinkles both under and to the outside edge of the eyes and some frown lines.
quang
A Fixture
A sensible approach would be to start with the ageing process itself and see how it works.
Everything changes/moves/fluctuates with time much less the human body and... the bone structure
of the skull. Most noticeable is the lower part of the face where the upper and lower jaws SHRINK following the receding action of the gums (teeth get loose).
The result: receding chin, thinner lips as teeth are 'sucked' inwards, more prominent cheek bones and eyes appear to sink deeper into the sockets. Lines and wrinkles are but the result of this shrinking effect much like limp clothes hanging on a body after a severe diet.
So the right move would be to CARVE OFF material from a 'normal' head instead of fleshing up as per our first impulse. Wrinkles and limp flesh can be added on only AFTER the bone structure has been corrected.
This is the main reason why ageing make-ups in cinema never worked. One can understand that Brad Pitt or Julia Roberts are reluctant to let makeup assistants 'carve off' their delicate bone structure ! :lol:
HTH,
Quang
I guess you got it by now. Bone structure ROCKS!
Everything changes/moves/fluctuates with time much less the human body and... the bone structure
of the skull. Most noticeable is the lower part of the face where the upper and lower jaws SHRINK following the receding action of the gums (teeth get loose). The result: receding chin, thinner lips as teeth are 'sucked' inwards, more prominent cheek bones and eyes appear to sink deeper into the sockets. Lines and wrinkles are but the result of this shrinking effect much like limp clothes hanging on a body after a severe diet.
So the right move would be to CARVE OFF material from a 'normal' head instead of fleshing up as per our first impulse. Wrinkles and limp flesh can be added on only AFTER the bone structure has been corrected.
This is the main reason why ageing make-ups in cinema never worked. One can understand that Brad Pitt or Julia Roberts are reluctant to let makeup assistants 'carve off' their delicate bone structure ! :lol:
HTH,
Quang
I guess you got it by now. Bone structure ROCKS!
John , there's not much I can add after Quang's usual prolific reply. ( you learn from this man just by thinking about him !!! :lol: ) After all that has been said by quang may I add that one of the most things I notice in ageing persons are the eyebags, apart from all the other things. They seem heavier and fuller.
Stephen Mallia
Stephen Mallia
quang
A Fixture
Hello Stephen,
We were in Gozo a few weeks ago.
I kept scrutinizing the face of every policeman I met but no luck! Next time maybe?
Q.
PS. I tried the fenek, the qarnit and the gozo cheese. Now I know how YOU feel. :lol:
We were in Gozo a few weeks ago.
I kept scrutinizing the face of every policeman I met but no luck!
Next time maybe? Q.
PS. I tried the fenek, the qarnit and the gozo cheese. Now I know how YOU feel. :lol:
Hi
While flicking thro the tv channels last night I saw a brief part of a program on cosmetic surgery, for a 72 year old man (a model - the man from Del Monte!!)
I caught the surgeon discussing what happens to a mans face when it ages. Men's skin is thicker and heavier than womens, an over the years it does sag, creating the bags and the cheek jowells(sp?). OK he's older than what you're after, John, but some of it seemed appropriate. Wish I'd paid more attention now. Needless to say I turned over before any cutting was done!
While flicking thro the tv channels last night I saw a brief part of a program on cosmetic surgery, for a 72 year old man (a model - the man from Del Monte!!)
I caught the surgeon discussing what happens to a mans face when it ages. Men's skin is thicker and heavier than womens, an over the years it does sag, creating the bags and the cheek jowells(sp?). OK he's older than what you're after, John, but some of it seemed appropriate. Wish I'd paid more attention now. Needless to say I turned over before any cutting was done!
Uruk-Hai
PlanetFigure Supporter
I am by no means an expert in sculpting or aging but shouldnt the nose and ears appear larger as these mostly are of cartilage and therefore build up the nose and ears of the years?
Einion
A Fixture
John, I presume this 15 years is from your typical stock head to a middle-aged man? There's a bit of a difference between how you'd go from 20 to 35 and 40 to 55
There are two broad approaches I can think of here. The first is additive and the second is subtractive. Many men 'fill out' as they approach middle age (I speak from experience) and their faces become fuller and less defined than in their 20s. If you want to go this route I would fill out the cheeks especially and also the sides of the head - the cheekbones and the temple area - you deposit fat quite widely on the head, as you can see from CAT scans. If the original head has quite flat upper cheeks under the eyes you can add a bit of a bag here too. Remember to target the neck and underside of the chin: the neck will tend to become fuller and lose definition and there is usually a change from the taut horizontal line from chin to throat to at least a slight downward angle, if not a definite fullness visible from the front.
For the subtractive approach, for someone you imagine has kept fit and health and lost his 'puppy fat' (like my current avatar in actual fact) I would hollow the cheeks in the area just under the cheekbones. You could also scrape down the temple a bit to define the area where the temporal muscle attaches from the jaw. In addition to just using a sharp #10 blade in the X-Acto I like to use a silicon rubber abrasive disk for this sort of work. Don't forget the neck here either, the Adam's apple and the throat itself may become a little more prominent and the sterno-mastoid muscles that run from under the ears to the inside points of the clavicles will be much more noticeable because of fat disappearing from the areas to either side of them. Since I presume this is a 1/32 head I wouldn't worry about sculpting lines, they are usually quite slight at this age and I would generally add them at the painting stage if at all. A possible exception would be the crease from the outer edge of the nostrils down to the jowls, but you can also accentuate this with paint quite effectively.
With advanced years it is important to note that ears and nose both grow as Janne pointed out, this isn't an illusion based on other areas shrinking
As for the putty to use I use MS for this sort of thing but I'm working over itself, it can be tricky to get it to stick to resin in small quantities, in which case Kneadatite or Apoxie might be better choices.
Einion
There are two broad approaches I can think of here. The first is additive and the second is subtractive. Many men 'fill out' as they approach middle age (I speak from experience) and their faces become fuller and less defined than in their 20s. If you want to go this route I would fill out the cheeks especially and also the sides of the head - the cheekbones and the temple area - you deposit fat quite widely on the head, as you can see from CAT scans. If the original head has quite flat upper cheeks under the eyes you can add a bit of a bag here too. Remember to target the neck and underside of the chin: the neck will tend to become fuller and lose definition and there is usually a change from the taut horizontal line from chin to throat to at least a slight downward angle, if not a definite fullness visible from the front.
For the subtractive approach, for someone you imagine has kept fit and health and lost his 'puppy fat' (like my current avatar in actual fact) I would hollow the cheeks in the area just under the cheekbones. You could also scrape down the temple a bit to define the area where the temporal muscle attaches from the jaw. In addition to just using a sharp #10 blade in the X-Acto I like to use a silicon rubber abrasive disk for this sort of work. Don't forget the neck here either, the Adam's apple and the throat itself may become a little more prominent and the sterno-mastoid muscles that run from under the ears to the inside points of the clavicles will be much more noticeable because of fat disappearing from the areas to either side of them. Since I presume this is a 1/32 head I wouldn't worry about sculpting lines, they are usually quite slight at this age and I would generally add them at the painting stage if at all. A possible exception would be the crease from the outer edge of the nostrils down to the jowls, but you can also accentuate this with paint quite effectively.
With advanced years it is important to note that ears and nose both grow as Janne pointed out, this isn't an illusion based on other areas shrinking
As for the putty to use I use MS for this sort of thing but I'm working over itself, it can be tricky to get it to stick to resin in small quantities, in which case Kneadatite or Apoxie might be better choices.
Einion
John Long
A Fixture
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2003
- Messages
- 1,500
What I have done so far is hollow the cheeks a little and accentuate the cheekbones. I filed some furrows in the brow. I accentuated the smile lines and rebuilt the upper lip. I want to represent a 45 year old man, so Idon't need to get too extreme. The expression is important as well. I want determination and a little reighteous indignation. I'll take some pics tonight if I get time. Thanks for all the advice. I hadn't given the nose and eard any consideration, so I may revisit those.
Einion, I haven't heard of the silicone disc. Where do you come up with these? It sounds very useful.
Einion, I haven't heard of the silicone disc. Where do you come up with these? It sounds very useful.
Einion
A Fixture
Hi John, they're one of the standard accessories for Minicraft drills - rubbery discs about 0.3" in diameter with embedded abrasive, I think they're originally intended for polishing hard metals. I like them because you can do things with them that you almost can't do with anything else since you're smoothly wearing away material; like most specialist tools I guess, once you have it you don't know how you'd live without it!
The sharp-edged one can be used for things like forming the furrow where you want to add a belt, I'd hate to think how much work it would require with a blade, burr and steel wool to do the same job. The discs wear down over time and one of my old ones is just a nub now but because it's a smaller diameter it's really useful for hollowing cheeks and that sort of job.
Einion
The sharp-edged one can be used for things like forming the furrow where you want to add a belt, I'd hate to think how much work it would require with a blade, burr and steel wool to do the same job. The discs wear down over time and one of my old ones is just a nub now but because it's a smaller diameter it's really useful for hollowing cheeks and that sort of job.
Einion
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