Casting of multi part figures? Hows it done?

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Cheers folks!

Mike your skills are legendary and by no means limited mate! your work speaks for itself.

The way I see it there is no right or wrong way, there's just your way. It's all about the end result!

Carl
 
Jon,
I don't know about the other guys but I certainly don't consider myself a 'big guns', thanks anyway. : )

Carl,
Wonderful traction engine, I'm surprised you couldn't flog it to someone for production, Southeastern Finecast for instance. What's the scale anyway? Although I would like to think myself capable of pattern making for such a complicated and many part piece as your tractor I doubt I'll ever find it in me to dedicate enough time to a single project to accomplish the task, especially as long as it remains a part time endeavor and there is, still, a real job to go to.

Calvin,
This is a nice saw frame here; http://www.ottofrei.com/store/product.php?productid=17004&cat=0&page=1 This frame is shallow in the depth from blade to frame but should make a good general purpose one for figure modeling. A deeper frame is desirable when making cuts further from the edge of a piece. Micro-Mark also carries a saw frame, but the quality and durability is less as the supporting part of the frame is made of a 'pot metal' (Zamac or something similar) casting, and the price is higher anyway.

The blade you use is dependant on the thickness of material you are cutting, or perhaps where figures are concerned the object may be to seek the thinnest blade possible. For cutting sheet material, thin material will require more teeth per inch of blade (a finer blade) while thicker material will obviously want fewer teeth per inch for efficiencies sake. The technique is not to push the blade through the material, as will a western style handsaw for cutting wood, but rather to draw the blade by pulling, usually downward while the piece rests on a bench block for support. The purpose here is to keep from breaking the blade should it bind during the cut. You'll break blades anyway, but a lot fewer if you draw the blade rather than pushing it into the cut.

Your e-bay find is exactly the thing, though it has a deeper frame than the one in my link and the price may be high or perhaps not. I couldn't really say without doing some math to find a value for the blades included.

Mike,
Don't you find mold making a more arduous and workman like task than sculpting? It really is its own art, and one I am never really that pleased to follow, doing it only from necessity. As you say knowledge of how a mold is made and how things are cast is a valuable thing for a pattern maker to know, even if he is lucky enough to never have to make any molds himself.

I think most of us are basically self taught learning techniques through reading and observation with a lot of trial and error along the way. If only there had been an internet back in the old days when I was first (first because I haven't stopped yet) trying to learn the skills of a sculptor and pattern making it would have save me a lot of the trial and error. A forum like this is a true blessing to the expert and novice alike I think, especially thinking myself somewhere between the two skill levels.

Anyone else here use Bear wire for armatures instead of bare wire, or is it just me?


Ray
 
Ray,

The traction engine was a pattern commissioned by a big company and they was going to produce it but didn't in the end. Don't know why! I cast the one in the picture.

Now they was complex moulds, we had to make the moulds with collapsible cores to get the piece out. It was certainly a challenge to cast.

Calvin,

The saw frame in the link is very expensive. Sutton Tools a rigid frame is only £5 or £6 approx. You Can also get the blades there. Get the Jaguar German blades there cheaper.

www.suttontools.co.uk

link to bench tools, saw frames and blades.

I hope this helps

Carl
 
Carl,
Too bad they never produced your engine, it is a beautiful piece. In the right scale-1/32-I'd like one for myself, I find the things fascinating, especially the way they were employed.

Thanks for the link, it's always nice browsing a new tool suppliers wares. I would probably still make my purchases from Ottofeil, or Naja (http://www.najatools.com/) simply because they are for me more local and I don't feel the bite of changing dollars into lbs.

How many different pair of pliers do you own Carl? lol


Ray
 
Ray,

I'm spoilt for choice here in Birmingham I have about 4 different tool shops that supply to the jewelery trade. It like an Aladdin's cave when you go. LOL!!

I'm not too extravagant I only have about 7 or 8 pairs of pliers, and 4 pairs of snips. LOL!!!

Carl
 
Well there is really no reason to get mad at each other. We all develop our skills in different ways. I wish I was better working with metals. I have not had the need. In most of the big shops I have worked in there have been guys who specialize in working with metal. I have done some, but it is hit and miss. I try and learn from the guys I work with. You never know when yo may just have to do it yourself. If you have taken the time to ask a few questions You would be surprised at how ready some of the old-timers are to pass on skills.

I have had to cut a few masters apart before and it is not easy and I spent a lot of time re-sculpting detail that was lost. I tried to put the cuts in logical places and to make the cut form a type of key. But give me a choice and I would have had the sculptor make it in pieces.
 
Hi Jeff,

We wasn't mad at each other just healthy debate :¬)

I agree with you 100%. I too have spent time over the years breaking pieces down for production that other sculptors have made. Some of these were paid many thousands of pounds to sculpt a fantastic piece of work and walk away, leaving someone else to make it practical and commercial. These are products with a huge retail value. Very few of us know what goes on behind the finished product Thankfully!

These are all things that make a sculptor into a pattern maker. The vision to see a piece (no matter how complex on the surface) as a commercial product, and go about there task quietly and efficiently regardless of methods, and produce this masterpiece that's a producable item. I have a huge admiration and respect for anyone who has that creative bent, whether that is with a paint brush or with a putty of some kind, or sat at a jewllers bench or turning a piece of wood My hat goes off to you all.

But there is one thing that has not been mentioned "pressure" this job like any other has pressure, you have to work to deadlines, these can be very tight and stressful, but thats the job. It's a fantastic job, I would not have it any other way!!!!

Carl
 
Deadlines? Ha, ha!!! My deadline is "when I get the rotten thing done". That can be a curse as well as a blessing. Too often in recent years I have taken it upon myself to redo bits two, three or four times. It can get pretty disheartening doing it wrong over and over before you finally figure it out.... Not to mention that the pay check stays the same regardless of how long I take. So, there really is no "pay-off" for getting things right if you keep making stupid blunders. In fact, it is a loss.

Ray asked, "Don't you find mold making a more arduous and workman like task than sculpting?"

Absolutely. That is why, once I learned how to do it, I never did it again! Mold making is a skill and an art. Good mold makers are very important to our business. But mold making is a drudge when compared to pattern making. It is also expensive, messy and time consuming. My workroom is enough of a disaster as it is, without adding the mess of molding and casting. I am a creative person and it is the creation of the thing that interests me. I would rather leave mold making up to those who practice that black art. So I do.

Mike
 
Mike,
I'm making molds this weekend, so be a gent and feel for me please.

Carl,
Seven or eight, not too many I suppose though I really don't know how many pair I have without counting. As an American television carpenter is fond of saying-I don't think he's ever said it about pliers though I think it would apply-'A man can't have too many clamps' (sub pliers for clamps and he's one of us). I've got that tool collector curse I'm afraid, so I purchase a new whatever every time I see something new. One day I'll have to count and then keep the number secret from my wife.



Ray
 
Wow,
what a great thread....so much information here!

To chip in a bit more
- thanks to all about the different ways of 'doing' a figure in multi part stages
- I'm glad all parties involved kept it civil; I agree with Gary, it has been a great thread, and all made an effort to keep it friendly. Going by the thread viewed count, this may be one of those threads that budding sculptors will research when they step into the commercial world!

- Jonathon, no, I wasn't planning on carving up the yukata figure, chatting with others here, I was kicking some ideas around with Ian & Kim Harries (Bussoboy & Mrs Bussoboy) of Empire on doing a small line of 'Duck' figures.... so bit of a general inquiry, partly specific too

- Carl, impressive tractor!
- Carl, Mike & Ray, thanks for sharing your ideas & experiences of the how & whys of multi part figures....

Thanks again for sharing

Cheers
 
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