My first figure sculpture

[Mat Lambert]

Hi Planet Figure,

After spending so much time looking at all the great work on PF and my two Bill Horan books I have decided to 'just do it' and start modelling again after nearly 20 years.

Have begun at the deep end and started by sculpting this figure - a type of model making that I never even did before. Got to start somewhere, hey?

Here it is so far, 54mm with Hornet head and Airfix multipose hands and boots. The sculpting material is Milliput. I have ordered some A+B and Kneadatite to experiment with on the clothes etc.

I am aiming to create Grenadier guard from the Crimean War.

Any feedback would be really appreciated - so many of you out there are doing fantastic things and it would be great to know what you think!

best
Mat

 

[Dan Morton]

Mat - I am by no means an expert sculptor, so take my comments with several grains of salt, please. I'm sure others will provide more help very quickly.

IMHO the anatomy is about right, but it looks like the body overall is too lavish. When you intend to do layers of putty, adding clothing, unless the body is fairly slender, the whole figure will eventually be too thick and will be out of proportion. So - unless you are planning to build a Superman body, I would sand or cut off some of the waist, hips, legs, arms and neck.

Good luck and keep at it!

All the best,
Dan

 

[MattS]

Check the gap between the legs. It seems a tad too wide. Perhaps a weight shift to one or the other legs might help him look a little more natural. People rarely stand with their weight equally balanced. If you do this, make sure the hips shift as well.

I'm working on a new full figure sculpt right now, too. Good reference is really important. I would encourage creating as close as possible to an anatomically proportioned figure before clothing him. Just apply your clothing layers later with the idea of scale thickness of the fabric.

Keep going!!

Matt

 

[Jamie Stokes]

I echo the others; great start.

I have rebuilt the same torso three times, because of
1- slightly too leggy
2- hips too broad, and legs should be under the hips, not to the sides
3- a fully clothed figure I am sculpting a bit skinny, as by the time I finish adding on clothes, it will bulk out too quick!

Head, shoulders and arms look good so far.

figure reference site here
http://www.fineart.sk/index.php?s=8&cat=12

keep in mind it's a drawing site, and if you are laying putty layer on top of putty layer, it will bulk out fast.

The less is more school

Keep up the progress though, smart to check in

Cheers

 

[Mat Lambert]

Thanks for the good advice guys.

Agree the hips have been too wide from the start.

I tried to make the pose have shifted weight on the hips too but it has been lost along the way - maybe my armature was too subtle!

Felt I needed to add all the muscle to begin with so I could get a better sense of the anatomy and figures pose. Will maybe try carving some off before adding the putty for the clothes.

Any advice on layering of the putty for the clothes - do I blob it on or roll out and wrap around the limbs? Had a test with the Kneadatite last night and it was very sticky - any tips?

cheers
Mat

 

[Ryder]

This is a question I also have wondered about. How to get the clothes on and not pull them back off without leaving finger prints or tearing or worse stretching.

Any advice on layering of the putty for the clothes - do I blob it on or roll out and wrap around the limbs? Had a test with the Kneadatite last night and it was very sticky - any tips?

cheers
Mat

 

[mil-mart]

Mat , welcome to Pf, great start to your sculpt. In answer to using Kneadatite it has been likened to chewing gum, IMHO I find it's best to leave once mixed for approx 20 mins then use by rolling a sausage shape the same size of the arm or leg for instance and then pressing onto the front and smoothing it around to the back. I also recommend mixing your A+B and Kneadatite together 50% for a better consistency .
Hope it's been of use neighbour.

Cheers Ken

 

[Einion]

Thanks for the good advice guys.

Agree the hips have been too wide from the start.

I tried to make the pose have shifted weight on the hips too but it has been lost along the way - maybe my armature was too subtle!

Good stuff for a first attempt, don't be too hard on yourself!

Felt I needed to add all the muscle to begin with so I could get a better sense of the anatomy and figures pose. Will maybe try carving some off before adding the putty for the clothes.

It's generally a good idea to go slimmer than you think you need, particularly at small scales. It's all too easy if you don't do this having the end result look unintentionally stocky.

Experienced sculptors can compensate for an anatomically-correct body when they're sculpting clothes (partly because they're more comfortable pressing hard on their tools, so it ends up really thin) but when you're starting out I would highly recommend working over a slim, even skinny, basic body shape.

Any advice on layering of the putty for the clothes - do I blob it on or roll out and wrap around the limbs? Had a test with the Kneadatite last night and it was very sticky - any tips?

Lubricate your tools - saliva, water, skin oils, talc, moisturiser, Vaseline, baby oil or vegetable oil.
Mix it with different proportions of resin and hardener (less blue); this makes it slightly less sticky but I find lubricating tools still necessary.
Wait for the Kneadatite to slightly cure before working it too much.
Blend it with something else to cut the stickiness.

Einion

 

[Mat Lambert]

Thanks for the tips Ken and Einion - I will try again with the Kneadatite tonight.
Hope to post some more pics soon to show you my progress on that.

Can any of the Pf regulars tell me if it is appropriate to post my project updates on this thread or in th vBench forum?

 

[1969]

Mat nice start with your jump into sculpting.

One thing you need to from the start is to realise that sometimes you have to bite the bullet and rework some parts even if it means cutting a leg off etc, its always worth it in the long run, even the most experiences sculpters on here wont get it all right first try.

I think you have done very well with the upper body which has a nice anatomy and pose, the bottom half could do with some adjustment to the leg width to tie in with the upper body more, dont be afraid to remove a leg and reposition it, its still possible at this stage before you start cloathing.

There is no reason why you shouldnt carry on your update in the sculpting section as far as i know.

Steve

 

[tonydawe]

Great start Mat,

I'm new to sculpting myself, so I understand your questions and your desire to get it right. Very few sculptors get it right the first time, so don't be too hard on yourself.

Welcome to the Dark Side of the Force.

 

[panzer007]

Good start friend... sculpt from anatomy is the right way!.
it is look good but the gap between legs is too far. try to cut and glue it again in right position.

Cheer!
Pongsatorn.K

 

[Mat Lambert]

First - thanks for the great welcome!

The last few posts convinced me to do some changes to the leg. Once glued into new position I could see it was the right thing to do - the figure looks much more natural. Filled out the join tonight, wanted to upload some images but my camera connection broke as I was doing them so will do tomorrow.

Cheers
Mat

 

[Mat Lambert]

Hi,

Thought I'd show how the reworked leg position ended up - better I think.

Forgive the early attempts at the Kneadatite trousers etc I'm about to carve that off and start again now!

cheers Mat

 

[Jamie Stokes]

Hi Mat,
looks good.

I am working on my first sculpt too, and when it comes to the clothing, I will segment it into two parts, with the waist line as start/ reference point.

My thinking is that the draping of the cloth from the hips down will be easier to sculpt if I am working in the direction of gravity, rather then 'uphill'.

Like wise, I will be sculpting the upper body from the shoulders down, for the same reason.

Just sharing a thought, others may better insights.

The repositioning looks better, and I can see you are making good progress.

And welcome to the world of do a bit, examine it, re work it.....

are you looking at the sculpted figure in a mirror every now and then? That really helps when checking your work.

Cheers

 

[Mat Lambert]

Thanks Jamie for the good remarks.

I like your gravity comment - logical really. Thats how I've started the new attempt, top down.
Funnily enough I sit my figure down in front of a mirror when I have finished so will pay more attention to it now. I've certainly found phographing it helps too.

cheers Mat

 

[Ray]

Jamie, Mat,
I may be the odd man out, or not, as I work a sculpt from the feet up most of the time. For a figure wearing a belt I'll usually add the belt before sculpting (strips of hardened and rolled flat green stuff, or in a pinch lead foil, preference being for the green stuff), this sets the trouser height line. If the figure isn't going to have a belt, or has an overlapping shirt or jacket, when I reach the waist line with the trousers I simply feather (blend) the trousers into the upper torso just above the waist. The trousers are sculpted one leg at a time, right first, usually, especially if the pants have a fly. This way when I do the left leg to make the fly all that is needed is to sculpt over the right side of the pants to the center line of the body. Button shirts are much the same, right side first overlapped by the left side. The exception is female clothing where everything is sometimes reversed.

I suppose for a figure like the one Jamie is working on (a kind of dress or gown, perhaps even an overcoat) it might be just as easy to work from the top down if there is not definite division between the top portion of the clothing and the bottom. Of course, following my usual method (if that's what it is) in reverse would work fine, I think, for a belted figure, but something has to be present to mark out the extra billowing of the shirt if it is tucked in. My suspicion is that I started working from the bottom up mostly because that is how clothing is usually layered, un-tucked shirts and jackets hang over pants, skirts etc. Other than that I can't offer a better explanation.

I do shirt collars the same way, shirt first collar last, if a tie is to be added and the center of the shirt not visible I'll sculpt the whole of the shirts front first. In the case of a vest only that portion of the shirt that will be visible above the vest is sculpted the bottom of which is blended into the figures body below where the top of the vest will be. Should the shirt sleeves be rolled up I'll sometimes sculpt this roll first then sculpt down to it latter, using the role much the same as a belt when sculpting pants.

In all events I always do my best to get the body as near as possible to a nude sculpt (without extremes of detail) before adding any clothing. This is because I know I'll screw up the anatomy if I rely on getting it right with the clothing, ending with spaghetti limbs or worse.

No matter what anyone else’s opinion (mine included) the right way to do the thing is the one that works best for you. But since I can't imagine anyone else’s way working best you must do it my way! lol


Ray

 

[LAXMAN05]

Good Start!

 

[Jamie Stokes]

Ray,
I think the key thing you mentioned is to examine what clothing will be worn, then decide upon approach.

The idea of having a belt on a reference point is excellent.

As are the ideas of doing sides of the clothing in a certain way, so the overlap falls the right way, depending on gender and style.

Thanks, you have probably saved me a notable degree of re sculpting!

Mat, what I am taking away from Rays post is;
- type of clothing
- how its being worn; summer with sleeves up, cooler with jacket, so on.
- breaks in the clothing (pants/ belt/shirt, or pant/ jacket or skirt) and where to sculpt the 'breaks'
-doing up the clothes - Zip, buttons, belt, sashes.
- land marks of the above.

As Ray (and other say) the best method is the method that works for you. It usually ends up being a combination of other peoples work that you like and could use.

Ray, good post.

Mat, take a deep breath now....and let it out slowly, so you relax. Don't fret too much about all this, lest your head explode.

making sure the figure is correct underneath makes it easier to correctly sculpt the clothing.

Good stuff,

Cheers

 

[Dan Morton]

Whatever works for you is the right approach...I second that. I used to know an older drummer who was "very" left-handed. Wrote lefty, threw lefty, batted lefty, etc., etc. But when he played, he played on a right-handed set-up drum kit. That would have driven me bonkers, but it worked for him and he was very good. As a kid, he taught me the difference between a "mommadaddy" and a paradiddle.

I classify myself in the learner category still, but some thoughts....

I start with as slender an anatomy as I can manage. Not anatomically correct - very skinny. The "skeleton" has finished boots before I start clothing it. When I put on clothing, I do it in sheets of thin putty. Thin sheets of putty can be made in a variety of ways, but I use an acrylic roller bar and a sheet of plate glass. A thin layer of talcum to prevent sticking on the plate glass. Pat the putty into the basic shape and then run the roller bar over it until uniformly the same thickness. Cut the sheet to fit. There is one advantage to putting on clothing in thin layers like this - it should help you to get clothing smooth and uniform-looking.

First, I put on the lower leg left and right, next upper legs to the waist, stop and let that dry completely. I don't heat clothing because sometimes thin layers of putty will bubble. I allow each segment to dry normally. I sculpt in some folds wet as I'm going along. Other folds I carve in after all the clothing is on. Next the torso paying particular attention to the way in which the coat or shirt fits at waist and neck. Usually I do the back torso as one sheet and then the front torso as a second. Each sheet is more or less cut to the shape - imagine paper dolls. Hadn't thought about the advantage of putting the belt on before the coat or shirt - - that makes sense and I think I'll try it. Finally the sleeves paying particular attention to the wrists. Hands can be added at this stage. I usually have a head finished way before I put on clothing and it is added at some point. Sometimes before the shirt or coat collar and lapels and sometimes after. Depends on how I want it to fit. After all of this, I go back and add details like epaulettes, buttons, etc. On coats and shirts I will cut in button holes after the folds are done and with the putty at about half firm. I sometimes cut in clothing seams while the putty is at this stage and sometimes not - it depends on the type of seam and how visible and prominent I want the seam to be. Cutting in seams when the putty is wet makes them cleaner and more visible. Cutting them in when the putty is dry makes them slightly less regular and less prominent. (Not always, but that's what happens when I do it!)

And one more comment about sculpting - - be prepared to throw it all out. Do it for the art and the skill and do it until it feels and looks right to you. Listen to the critique of others, but trust yourself. And keep trying. Persistence will pay off.

All the best,
Dan