Andrew Dalziel
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Martin64, the victim isn’t in any way “sexy” she’s about to be raped. Blaming the victim is being complicit.
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Andrey
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Martin64
A Fixture
.... I rest my case.
Martin Antonenko
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The difference is, that the SS officer is not shown/sculpted while laughingly murdering your grandfather or throwing "Zyklon B" into a gas chamber. If you don't understand this difference, then you can't be helped.
I have noticed certain changes in your choice of topic recently: First this unspeakable "Baba Z", on whose personal rights of Mrs. Ivanova you have given a damn (good that this stupid propaganda dirt was deleted by the admin!) and now this atrocity.
Too bad, you once made wonderful figures, I own quite a few myself
But to a sculptor, who makes a rape scene like this with cheerful feixing men I would recommend a visit to the psychologist!
I ask the admins again to delete this thread.
1)
It's surely not quite all right . Since more then 60 years in the EU, all representations of the SS runes or/and the Nazi flags are not allowed by law, toys included . Big companies as Tamyia had to change they Arts Boxes by removing all SS and Nazi flags
2) estimation of death toll in Soviet Union, base on the 1939 existing population, shows total miltary + civilians 21 to 26M, among them military for 11 - to 13M ( not counting the 220.000 soviet killed in combat fighting for the Nazi ), so civilian deaths amount to 11 to 13 ( 50%), all those death represented 16% or the total population . The only other country with such a big % is Poland ( also 16% of the population of 1939 ) but there, there is another difficulty, because as you know, they were attacked on both side : North by Germans, South by Soviets; that according to the Molotov pact which had decided of who will take what territory in EU . You took far more territories than those in the pact after the end of the war .
Please, note that I'm sincerely sad you lost your grandfather in this war, as so many peoples in all parts of the world under attack , my grandmother, my mother and my aunts told me many times how they were under fire attack by the Stuka, when flewing away from conflict . My friend Marie, told me how she lost all her family death in concentration camp, she survived because a neighbourh took her by the arm, sayeng " no don't go home, the Nazi are there ", she stayed hidden by those neighbours during 3 years .
And we surely can not continue to hate peoples for what their ancestors have done in the past .
AND for me the subject is closed .
ASTRA
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I, as a sculptor who made this scene, fully agree with you.This is a rather complex composition in one interpretation or another.It is far from a fact that rape should occur (people come up with something, guided by their conjectures), the dress is torn because she just tried to run away when the woman was caught.) Two more figures will be present in the composition.
ASTRA
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So this scene does not depict rape, only soldiers and a half-naked girl
People are trying to think something to the extent of their promiscuity.
ASTRA
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"Just about" is when the penis is near the vagina.Stop talking nonsense and spreading your unhealthy fantasy.
Martin64
A Fixture
Thank you for participating in this "thread in flames" and sharing your thoughts as the sculptor. IMHO the theme of this scene is very difficult to translate into a model without causing misunderstandings. Without doubt these things happen in reality but in modelling as a builder or spectator you have to take a side in the scene. The "Stage" you created should not include the option to enjoy the situation of the victim. I hope you get what I wanted to express. The quality of the sculpt is very nice btw. Cheers Martin
santi fernandez
Well-Known Member
Rape is "politics"...? Really?
One reason why I do not like to answer is the difficulty of understanding with the language that is not mine, I will not give opinions again so as not to have disagreements with other people.
Painting and fun, nothing more.
Santi.
Oh, so we are unhealthy but the scene you sculpted is? So maybe now "brave" warriors are trying to help the poor girl? And that is why one of them is holding her butt with his middle finger pressed we all see where? Or maybe suddenly it's just broke and it's just me having some unhealthy fantasy?
Do you really expect the members of this forum to be as naive as Russians and buy such a pathetic explanation collapsed in the form of an attack?
Do you really expect the members of this forum to be as naive as Russians and buy such a pathetic explanation collapsed in the form of an attack?
Martin64
A Fixture
These scenes are difficult and controversial in films likewise. The model or diorama squeezes the story into one moment and is therefore more demanding for the creator IMHO. Good luck for your further development and additions to this project.
Martin Antonenko
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Yes, yes, and one soldier only touches her in the back to make sure that her butt doesn't accidentally fall down. And the scene is therefore not called "Woe to the Vanquished" but "Soldiers helping a young woman".
Oh Mann!
DEL
A Fixture
Leaving aside the quasi poltical interpretations of the composition, who is actually going to buy this?
With so much choice in the market regarding medieval figures if you want a vignette have a look at Tartars range.
Better sculpted, animated and interactive and far less offensive.
Not that I would buy it but, I'd have trouble explaining why I did to my adult sons never mind my wife and daughter.
Derek
With so much choice in the market regarding medieval figures if you want a vignette have a look at Tartars range.
Better sculpted, animated and interactive and far less offensive.
Not that I would buy it but, I'd have trouble explaining why I did to my adult sons never mind my wife and daughter.
Derek
kagemusha
A Fixture
If I may offer this (purely personal) interpretation of this scene/group.
First off...take out the female...and what you are left with is a group of soldiers...probably drunk...telling bawdy jokes.
Secondly...if the female figure was not bare breasted...and had a laughing face/expression...given that one of the men has his hand on her behind...it would just be drunken soldiers having a laugh with a 'wench'.
Now...as it is currently depicted...the females expression is one of discomfort...and the male expressions are leers not laughs...and this was what touched a nerve with me...and set me on edge.
Given that tensions the world over are running high right now...the current political trends tend towards not giving a damn about the little people...and this is what comes through to me personally...where's the help when you need it.
Let's be honest enough just to say it's a controversial piece...wrong time wrong place...and it would never find it's way onto my bench.
Ron
First off...take out the female...and what you are left with is a group of soldiers...probably drunk...telling bawdy jokes.
Secondly...if the female figure was not bare breasted...and had a laughing face/expression...given that one of the men has his hand on her behind...it would just be drunken soldiers having a laugh with a 'wench'.
Now...as it is currently depicted...the females expression is one of discomfort...and the male expressions are leers not laughs...and this was what touched a nerve with me...and set me on edge.
Given that tensions the world over are running high right now...the current political trends tend towards not giving a damn about the little people...and this is what comes through to me personally...where's the help when you need it.
Let's be honest enough just to say it's a controversial piece...wrong time wrong place...and it would never find it's way onto my bench.
Ron
DEL
A Fixture
That is at best a ridiculous, fatuous and pathetic comparison.
Admired for its sculpting, animation and painting.
And to be clear Culloden wasn't a massacre it was a heavy military defeat in combat not the indiscriminate slaughter of civilians.
What we see there is a scene involving combatants who are 'signed up' for and invested in conflict.
The asault scene is on a civilian and if anything makes me wonder why anyone would want to sculpt it in the first place.
All that it achieves is damage to the reputation of the company.
The hole gets deeper.
D.
Admired for its sculpting, animation and painting.
And to be clear Culloden wasn't a massacre it was a heavy military defeat in combat not the indiscriminate slaughter of civilians.
What we see there is a scene involving combatants who are 'signed up' for and invested in conflict.
The asault scene is on a civilian and if anything makes me wonder why anyone would want to sculpt it in the first place.
All that it achieves is damage to the reputation of the company.
The hole gets deeper.
D.
Martin Antonenko
A Fixture
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what cynicism, and how did you explain to them your admiration for the scene of the massacre, which you admired?
The stupidest arguments have to be used to justify this crap. It is a real pity that some of our Russian colleagues seem to have lost their human standards after seven months of war and propaganda.
How can one even come up with the idea of comparing the historically accurate depiction of a battle with the rape of a non-combatant and, in the case of justified criticism, then relativizing it in the most ridiculous way.
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