Wellingtons Infantry Uniforms?

[chailey]

Can I ask the Napoleonic buffs how the general appearance of the average British Infantryman would look after a longish spell fighting in Spain?
I have read an account which states that the uniforms started to fall to bits fairly rapidly and the sun bleached out the colours, would you think that the Rifles uniforms in the 'Sharpe' TV series would be close to accurate?
Also how well would the Shako stand up to the Spanish environment?
Any thoughts more than welcome!

Steve

 

[arj]

Try this article:-
http://www.napolun.com/mirror/napoleonistyka.atspace.com/napoleonic_uniforms.html
Click on 'Coats, Greatcoats and Undercoats' and in the third paragraph under 'Coat (Jacket)' you'll find:-
"Green as worn by jagers and rifle regiments proved particularly prone to fading until suitable chemical dyes were devised in the 1890s."
Somewhere, I've a vague recollection of reading that the Rifle Green could degrade to a muddy brown, but can't confirm with a reference.

Cheers,
Andrew

 

[Chrisr]

Somewhere, I've a vague recollection of reading that the Rifle Green could degrade to a muddy brown, but can't confirm with a reference.

Cheers,
Andrew

Yes, I have read that as well, but can't confirm the source.

Chris

 

[billyturnip]

Yes, I have read that as well, but can't confirm the source.

Chris

I'm pretty sure I have too and I have a feeling it's mentioned in Military Dress of the Peninsular War by Martin Windrow and illustrated by Gerry Embleton.

 

[Tony Barton]

Certainly madder red fades to a brick colour, a sort of dusty red-brown. Indigo blue goes a dark purplish shade. There is the famous anecdote of two officers comparing their blue and scarlet uniforms, and being more or less unable to tell the difference.
But the terrible state that uniforms might get into would depend on the time of year : remember that the rank and file got new uniforms every winter, and officers mostly had spares.
Rifle green was not a single stable dye, as has been said, but a mixture of dyestuffs. Until they invented a good chemical dye in the very late 19c, the uniforms in the second half of the 19c were effectively black, but whether that was true in the Spanish War I don't know.

 

[chailey]

Thanks all for your input, the thing is I'm really struggling with coming up with a believable 'Rifle green' without it looking like he's come straight from the parade ground, I have already stripped him down twice!
I reckon if I opt for a faded grey/green I won't be too far off the mark.........

Cheers,

Steve

 

[Huw63]

Hi

Just a thought about this thread. A jacket could be covered in dirt and black powder stains after an engagement so might look dark too, especially the right side of the face. shoulder and upper arm.

I suggest you download paint charts - Vajello, Windsor and Newton and other reputable paint manufacturers (it doesn't matter what sort of paint) to get ideas.

Cheers

Huw

 

[chailey]

Thanks Huw,
The nearest I can find to what I'm looking for are Vallejo, bronze green or maybe black green, with copious amounts of English uniform and flesh to 'dirty it up a little...
I'm a little concerned by Vallejo's greens tendency to gloss up but I guess I can always get over that with spray of mat varnish.
Good idea with the powder stains, a chance to use some of the dry pigments I bought and never used!
Anyone have any thoughts about the Shako, did they retain their shape after being dropped/ rained on/sat on etc?

 

[Huw63]

Just a thought but Scale 75 Ardennes Green mixed with S75 Black Forest green and S75 Matt black gave a good base for a green for a chasseur uniform I'm trying out then over painting with diluted Andrea Napoelonic Green gave a good base.

Now I recall that the 95 did make some uniforms with local brown cloth.

Cheers

Huw

 

[chailey]

"Now I recall that the 95 did make some uniforms with local brown cloth"!!!!
I'm having enough trouble with the green..........

cheers for that Huw,

 

[Huw63]

Should have added that the ration of the scale 75 pairs I used was 1:1:1

 

[Windy]

I use enamels so this may not be much help I'm afraid, but a 70:30 mix of Humbrol 76 and 33 gives a very good Rifle Green to use as a base. Thats what I used on the wee fella in my avatar anyway.

 

[Huw63]

I use enamels so this may not be much help I'm afraid, but a 70:30 mix of Humbrol 76 and 33 gives a very good Rifle Green to use as a base. Thats what I used on the wee fella in my avatar anyway.

Thanks Windy. Another mix worth knowing about.

For Chailey: 76 is uniform green, 33 is Matt black. I hope my latest top app imodelkit is correct!

Cheers

Huw

 

[Windy]

Thanks Windy. Another mix worth knowing about.

For Chailey: 76 is uniform green, 33 is Matt black. I hope my latest top app imodelkit is correct!

Cheers

Huw

No dramas. I should add that the ratio is very approximate. I just keep on mixing until it looks right - i.e. roughly the same colour as my beret!

 

[Huw63]

No dramas. I should add that the ratio is very approximate. I just keep on mixing until it looks right - i.e. roughly the same colour as my beret!

Which battalion? Black Mafia?

 

[Windy]

6 Rifles. I'm a filthy STAB! :-D

 

[Huw63]

One point I didn't answer is that the shakos would become battered and if it was raining and no cover was put on then they wound pretty quickly become mishshapen as the quality of manufacture was often quite poor.

Cheers

Huw

 

[chailey]

Thanks Windy,
It's only taken me two years to complete the transfer from Humbrols to acrylic's, but in a previous life I painted one of Richard Almond's Riflemen with Deck Green, black and flesh tone.....Oh for the good old days when life was simple!

Thanks Huw,
I 've not had much dealing with the Scale 75 paints but I know they are highly rated, the colours look to be quite bright but obviously it's going to be a big difference on a monitor.It's as I thought re. the head-gear, perhaps adding a battered cover by some means would be the way forward!

Steve

 

[chailey]

Footnote to the above,
I have been informed via a Napoleonic buff on another site that the 'Stovepipe' style shako were never issued with covers of any type, they were described as 'lacquered' implying they were at the very least partially water proof....
The intention was that the Shako should be replaced annually, I wonder how often that happened?

So back to the battered Shako I guess!

 

[Huw63]

Thanks Windy,
It's only taken me two years to complete the transfer from Humbrols to acrylic's, but in a previous life I painted one of Richard Almond's Riflemen with Deck Green, black and flesh tone.....Oh for the good old days when life was simple!

Thanks Huw,
I 've not had much dealing with the Scale 75 paints but I know they are highly rated, the colours look to be quite bright but obviously it's going to be a big difference on a monitor.It's as I thought re. the head-gear, perhaps adding a battered cover by some means would be the way forward!

Steve

I started trying acrylic paints as underpainting for oils but found them wonderful so I bought a few more, and a few more and a few more.... now I'm thinking of using them for all material parts but oils for flesh and leather. I'm still not sure to be honest.