1st Cavalry Div. from Young
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JGREEN
A Fixture
Excellent sculpt and paint. I have one question though: He is shown wearing a rip-stop BDU top in woodland camo. Did they have those in 1970/Vietnam?? I wore BDU tops like that in the mid-to-late 90's. I'm no expert and could easily be mistaken, but I didn't think that type of garment dated back that far.
Jason
Jason
Bournouna
Well-Known Member
Did they have those in 1970/Vietnam?
No Jason, they did not. Beautiful sculpt though. Will get one.
Joel
No Jason, they did not. Beautiful sculpt though. Will get one.
Joel
They did, ERDL camo was the fore runner to the woodland pattern, usually worn by Special forces though and it did have a pattern to the fabric like ripstop, see this preserved example
The United States Marine Corps (USMC) adopted the green "Lowland" version as standard issue in Vietnam from 1968, and later the U.S. Army introduced it on a wide scale in Southeast Asia. A third variation, unofficially known as "Delta" from an alleged use in the Mekong Delta area of South Vietnam, was issued in the early 1970s. It was simply a color variation and not specifically developed for the Delta region. It was common for Marines to wear mixes of ERDL and OG-107 jungle fatigues, which was authorized owing to periodic shortages. Australian and New Zealand SAS were also issued U.S.-issue Tropical combat uniforms in ERDL during their time in Vietnam. By the end of the Vietnam War, American troops wore camouflage combat dress as the norm.[7] "Delta" ERDL is the same as "Highland" pattern, but the black "branches" appear thicker and less detailed. The ERDL-pattern combat uniform was identical in cut to the OG-107 jungle fatigues it was issued alongside.[8]
Following the withdrawal of the U.S. military from Vietnam in 1973, the Army no longer routinely issued camouflage clothing. However, soldiers in the 1st and 2d Ranger Battalions (1/75 & 2/75 Ranger [Airborne]) received ERDL jungle fatigues of all three varieties as organizational issue, and the 1st Battalion, 13th Infantry Regiment wore the ERDL-leaf pattern as an experiment in the early 1970s in Baumholder, Germany. During this same period the 82d Airborne Division and 36th Airborne Brigade (Texas National Guard) were issued the ERDL jungle fatigues until replaced by BDUs. In 1976, the Marines obtained the leftover Vietnam-era ERDL pattern uniforms which became general issue, replacing the solid OG "sateen" utility/fatigue uniform. As there was never an ERDL pattern Marine-style utility cap, the Marines continued to wear the solid OG utility hat until the adoption of the BDU pattern. It was to be used to equip the United States Rapid Deployment Force (RDF) while on tropical missions. Photographs during the 1979 Iranian hostage crisis showed U.S. Embassy Marines wearing the RDF version ERDL uniforms when they were taken prisoner by Iranian revolutionaries.
The United States Marine Corps (USMC) adopted the green "Lowland" version as standard issue in Vietnam from 1968, and later the U.S. Army introduced it on a wide scale in Southeast Asia. A third variation, unofficially known as "Delta" from an alleged use in the Mekong Delta area of South Vietnam, was issued in the early 1970s. It was simply a color variation and not specifically developed for the Delta region. It was common for Marines to wear mixes of ERDL and OG-107 jungle fatigues, which was authorized owing to periodic shortages. Australian and New Zealand SAS were also issued U.S.-issue Tropical combat uniforms in ERDL during their time in Vietnam. By the end of the Vietnam War, American troops wore camouflage combat dress as the norm.[7] "Delta" ERDL is the same as "Highland" pattern, but the black "branches" appear thicker and less detailed. The ERDL-pattern combat uniform was identical in cut to the OG-107 jungle fatigues it was issued alongside.[8]
Following the withdrawal of the U.S. military from Vietnam in 1973, the Army no longer routinely issued camouflage clothing. However, soldiers in the 1st and 2d Ranger Battalions (1/75 & 2/75 Ranger [Airborne]) received ERDL jungle fatigues of all three varieties as organizational issue, and the 1st Battalion, 13th Infantry Regiment wore the ERDL-leaf pattern as an experiment in the early 1970s in Baumholder, Germany. During this same period the 82d Airborne Division and 36th Airborne Brigade (Texas National Guard) were issued the ERDL jungle fatigues until replaced by BDUs. In 1976, the Marines obtained the leftover Vietnam-era ERDL pattern uniforms which became general issue, replacing the solid OG "sateen" utility/fatigue uniform. As there was never an ERDL pattern Marine-style utility cap, the Marines continued to wear the solid OG utility hat until the adoption of the BDU pattern. It was to be used to equip the United States Rapid Deployment Force (RDF) while on tropical missions. Photographs during the 1979 Iranian hostage crisis showed U.S. Embassy Marines wearing the RDF version ERDL uniforms when they were taken prisoner by Iranian revolutionaries.
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Bournouna
Well-Known Member
I thought we were talking about the 1st Cav., which the figure represents. I went on Google and took a look at hundreds of pictures of the 1st Cav. grunts, and did not see a single one wearing camos. Would be curious to see one.
Tony Dawe
A Fixture
I believe the initial point was more about the rip-stop fabric, not ERDL camouflage pattern. Rip-stop uniforms are relatively modern. I've never seen any US rip-stop uniforms from Vietnam era. There may be some but I'm curious to know if anyone has evidence of rip-stop uniforms in US service in Vietnam.
No disrespect to Kirril's painting , which is stunning as always. I'll be getting this bust.
No disrespect to Kirril's painting , which is stunning as always. I'll be getting this bust.
Kevindunne
A Fixture
Looking at my uniform from Viet
Nam...1970...it is ripstop. Camos were only issued, in the Army, to Recon, and Special Ops. My battalionr econ platoon wore them and this paint job is pretty close to the color as issued...but they faded fast.
A small point...recon guys would not be on a mission with red cigarette packs and playing cards on their helmets.
All that having been said...its a great sculpt and paint job.
Nam...1970...it is ripstop. Camos were only issued, in the Army, to Recon, and Special Ops. My battalionr econ platoon wore them and this paint job is pretty close to the color as issued...but they faded fast.
A small point...recon guys would not be on a mission with red cigarette packs and playing cards on their helmets.
All that having been said...its a great sculpt and paint job.
Martin Antonenko
A Fixture
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Cheers
oldtrousers
PlanetFigure Supporter
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Nice sculpt and excellent paint work. Thank you Mr. Dunne for your comments as a primary source! I would note that this bust's uniform can also be painted to depict him wearing the standard OG-107 Jungle Uniform instead of ERDLs as the basic cut and pocket placement of both uniforms are the same. My only criticism is that the 1st Cav patch seems too small.
Scott
Scott
Kevindunne
A Fixture
I agree...hopefully its not molded on.
Martin Antonenko
A Fixture
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I think, the size of the patch is allright - for there were also those smaller variants...:
Cheers
Cheers
Gellso
A Fixture
Stunning painting.
Re the historical accuracy discussion.
I'm pretty sure that Sammy Davis Junior wasn't in the Air Cavalry. He was a singer/actor made popular with films starring Dean Martin.
I really wish people were more accurate.
Just my two cents
Re the historical accuracy discussion.
I'm pretty sure that Sammy Davis Junior wasn't in the Air Cavalry. He was a singer/actor made popular with films starring Dean Martin.
I really wish people were more accurate.
Just my two cents
Martin Antonenko
A Fixture
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The picture was taken during an appearance of Sammy Davis Jr. at soldiers of the 1st Cav. in Vietnam.
The shirt with the patch he had received before his performance by members of the unit.
In addition, the two other pictures with the small patch I loaded up show no singers / actors but "real" soldiers in Vietnam!
I really wish there would be more people who think before they mob ...
Cheers
The shirt with the patch he had received before his performance by members of the unit.
In addition, the two other pictures with the small patch I loaded up show no singers / actors but "real" soldiers in Vietnam!
I really wish there would be more people who think before they mob ...
Cheers
Bournouna
Well-Known Member
"I'm pretty sure that Sammy Davis Junior wasn't in the Air Cavalry."
You're right about that, I think he was with the 83rd Airborne. Next thing you're going to tell us, is that John Wayne wasn't a Green Beret, now really.
You're right about that, I think he was with the 83rd Airborne. Next thing you're going to tell us, is that John Wayne wasn't a Green Beret, now really.
Another masterpiece for Young !!!
Tony Dawe
A Fixture
Jimi Hendrix was in the 101st Airborne
Bournouna
Well-Known Member
"Jimi Hendrix was in the 101st Airborne"
So was our PF friend Kevin Dunne.
Joel
So was our PF friend Kevin Dunne.
Joel
JGREEN
A Fixture
The picture was taken during an appearance of Sammy Davis Jr. at soldiers of the 1st Cav. in Vietnam.
The shirt with the patch he had received before his performance by members of the unit.
In addition, the two other pictures with the small patch I loaded up show no singers / actors but "real" soldiers in Vietnam!
I really wish there would be more people who think before they mob ...
Cheers
Relax, Martin! (and learn to recognize OBVIOUS sarcasm, as in Gellso's post). I see no evidence of anyone "mob"bing here. Just looks to me like a good discussion of Vietnam era uniforms, and an informative one at that. In fact, the only offensive/provocative language is from you, when you condescendingly expressed your wish that there were more people "who think."
Jason
Martin Antonenko
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Hi Jason!
"I really wish people were more accurate."
"...and learn to recognize OBVIOUS sarcasm, as in Gellso's post). "
Aha, I understand - this is sarcasm... Thanks for the explanation.
"I really wish people were more accurate."
"...and learn to recognize OBVIOUS sarcasm, as in Gellso's post). "
Aha, I understand - this is sarcasm... Thanks for the explanation.
