improving planetFigure

[Pete_H]

Patrick, Anders, & Paul Kelly ... okay, you convinced me. I'll post my original posting.

Here it is ...

Okay, I'll bite. Now my comments are bound to p--s some of you off so sorry if I ruffle your feathers. It is neither my intent to come across as a "know-it-all", so I also apologize if my posting sounds like it.

Guy is absolutely on the money. We post our work and almost certainly get one of two results:
1. no comments at all.
2. almost nothing but "wow, best work ever!" comments.

If we want to become better painters/sculptors, then we have to learn from our mistakes and/or defficiencies. Perhaps if others point them out to us, we will see them. Still, it is human nature to at least feel a small "sting" when hearing such constructive comments. Yes, I feel that sting when I hear from others about what I can improve upon. I feel it not because of ego, but because I think to myself "damn, I should've thought of that!" This is commonly followed by "lesson learned, so try not to forget it next time." It is then that I feel I am taking at least a small step forward in improving my skills. But this would not happen unless I find out what I can improve upon and how to do it - let the "sting" serve me well.

On the other hand, if all I hear is "whoa, that is amazing! Your best work ever!" then it will be difficult at best to learn from my mistakes and move ahead. If all one gets is such feedback, then one may be lulled into a sense of complete and absolute accomplishment. No accomplishment should be complete, for we should always strive to improve even to the smallest extent. If we believe that our accomplishment is absolute, then the door towards advancement of our skills is shut.

Let's get out there and help each other by being honest, supportive, and - most of all - constructive in our critiques. The "sting" we'll certainly feel can and should be tempered with pointing out the strengths in our work. Now, if the painter/sculptor takes a truly constructive comment the wrong way, then that's his problem and good luck to him in furthering his skills. We're all gaining a lot from the resources offered here, and my thanks go out to Gordy and the staff. But we can gain a lot more if we're constructive and honest with our comments, as well as growing a skin thick enough to take it and learn from them.

As for my work posted here, let me have it. Tell me what I can improve on, tell me what I'm doing right and doing wrong, help me learn how I can better myself as a painter, and be constructive about it. As Richard Nixon once said, "sock it to me."

 

[Guy]

So true Pete........My eyes look at what I am working on so much....they miss things that I either missed or could of done differently. A fresh pair of eyes (about 860 pairs) sure does help me see things and grow with my skill. I have posted some sub-standard figures here and yet I get the hoopla's. Come on guys......be constructive. I got my first gold by listening to a judge tear me apart......but I listened and made corrections......and that elusive gold finally came home.

 

[Patrick Kirk]

Here, here!
Right you are Petey...we have to be willing to check ego's, too if in fact what we want to do is grow as an artist and as a community...The only way to grow is to learn is through feedback that enables us to improve. Sometimes harsh and sometimes packaged very well. In any event, the individual has to decide how to handle the feedback...and take that emotion and pour it back into another attempt with the purpose of improving.

I'm with Petey...be honest with me and my work, it's the only way I will aspire to reach the to which I am capable of achieving...and if I stagnate than it's a lick on me...

 

[KeithP]

Good post Pete. I agree.

I only give critiques if the poster requests it.

I would say that about 50% of the time that I have given critiques, there has been NO response to the critique. So, often I wonder how "well" my comments have been received.

Secondarily, as I have no club to attend to get live and in the flesh critiques of my work, I strongly rely on a give and take dialogue. So, responses back from my comments are valuable and helpful to my technique too as it makes me think thru the problem/issue. Hope this makes sense...

Good stuff!

Keith

 

[btavis]

If you want worthwhile critiques on your work I think it is best to prime the pump so that people know that you are ready, willing and able to receive constructive criticism.

For example, point out certain things that you felt you had problems with or specific areas in which you wish criticism to be directed so that you can improve.

This may serve to prevent bruised egos and give a clear signal to reviewers that comments beyond just the superlatives are required.

It goes without saying that if someone does spend the time to give constructive feedback it is a common courtesy on the part of the modeler to respond. Otherwise people will not waste their time if they feel they are talking to a wall.

 

[gordy]

Rules
#16 If you are posting a completed piece or work in-progress and wish to have it critiqued, include in your topic that you wish to have it critiqued. (The mention of minor differences does not apply as a critique). Any non-constructive comments will be removed at the descretion of the staff.

This also

vBench compliments and the lack there of. Understandably, postings in the vBench section will have many or few to no compliments. The vBench is not a popularity contest, competition or an awards show. The vBench serves only as a diary of works in progress. In addition, we at planetFigure have no problems of vBench authors linking to their vBench on other sites, or forums.

 

[Automata]

Bob has a really good point. Sometimes when people ask for critiques, they might not really be all that receptive to them. I think a lot of us are a bit hesitant to give truly open critiques since they sometimes seem to end up offending the poster. Let's try to take rule 16 to heart.

Along the same lines, critics should not be offended if their suggestion is not acted upon. I think it's a good idea to respect a person's right to disagree politely with a suggestion.

Barry

 

[megroot]

Okay Pete, and others who gave a reaction at PeteH point.

You all are wright about the critques.
But the beginning of the tread was how to help improve the site.
Yes one of these points is critiques on work of painters, but that is not the main discussion.
The discussion was to improve for instance the welcome page, and maybe others.
Lets don't forget that.

For me,
You can shoot as much as you want even with a great calliber in my SBS Celtic Chieftain. I improved a lot thanks to this SBS and know now what i should be looking at in the future.

Marc.

 

[Pete_H]

Marc Van Megroot,
The point I was trying to make is that the responsibility for improving doesn't only rest upon the shoulders of the pF staff, but upon our own - the membership - as well. Yes, Gordy and his staff can do so much to improve the site. However, any amount of website improvement depends directly upon what we the members care to do about it as well. Any form of technical improvements in this forum depends directly upon improvements in the content of membership participation, and vice versa. Hence, all the 's and "wow, best work ever!!!" comments won't improve us as painters, which in turn cheats the forum out of being made use of its full potential.
Improving planetFigure is a double-edged sword - improvements in format and improvements in participation are what result in a true overall improvement in the entire forum ... at least, that's my humblest of opinions.

 

[megroot]

Hello Pete,

No mistaking, i am totally agree with you.
But when i read the last two or three comments i thought that we get of the essention of the question: " To Improve The Planet ".
I agree that a comment on what stage of painting proces done on a figure must be a good comment.
As you said before, we can just getting better by comments and critiques that is gonna help us forward to improve the painting.
That's what i like about the Planet.
Noting wrong with that, for me, i can have more critiques than i have had so far.
When it is not good, than it is not good. But people are sometimes afraid of saying that it is not good because they think that the person who posted it is gonna be hurt and leave the painting for what it was.
If you posted your figure on the planet for judging then you must accept critique. And i 'am all the way with you, the words are almost everytime nice here on the PF. (hope this is good English).

So Pete, maybe it is my bad english, but i was not intend to bring your opion down (i hope i make it clear )

Marc

 

[Joe Hudson]

Hey everyone,

I agree with all the above but have been sitting back and just looking. I can agree that there are many great jobs and etc. I too have said some and I too have received a few. I will take for example that I think the Elvis figure is not my best work and needs much improvement and I hope to do this on my next figures.

I have a suggestion and you all can take it with a grain of salt if you do not like it Why not when someone post something and ask for some critique, make it a point to give a good point and one that maybe they could work on? This way it is not going to always be positive or just negative. I have seen some work that all of it was not great but there were parts that were really good and vice versa.

Anyway this is just my 2 cents.

Joe

 

[yeo_64]

Hear,Hear,Joe ! A well-put across point. I,for one,have improved alot because of the honest feedback that I got to the figures that I had posted here on the "planet". Cheers !
Kenneth :lol: