Completed Critique Prinz Oskar Bust

[dave mosher]

Filipe

Not at all. I have been collecting imperial officer feldgrau uniforms for a while, so I am positive that for the M 1910 waffenrock, the background for the single bar litzen on officers for Gren-Rgt. Nr. 7 is lemon yellow (also for Gren-Rgt. Nr. 5, Gren-Rgt. Nr. 6 and Gren-Rgt. Nr. 11). Also the top picture you have shown above is Prinz Oskar wearing the M1915 feldbluse with the muted single bar officer litzen for all grenadiers. The background color is the "apple green" that matches the collar. The bottom photo is the M1910 waffenrock, but he is wearing it after 1915 as indicated by the double piping on the shoulder boards, white on the bottom, yellow on the top. With black and white photos, yellow shows up very dark. The table you have shown above is for enlisted waffenrocks. Another incorrect item I noted was the red piping you have painted around the Brandenburg cuff area (the narrow vertical piece where the litzen is attached), which would be incorrect for the Prussian grenadiers and guard grenadiers, which had no piping on that area. If you would like, I'll try to scan some references for review.

Regards

Dave

 

[dave mosher]

delete this double posting

 

[dave mosher]

delete this double posting

 

[Filipe]

Dave

Let´s go

so I am positive that for the M 1910 waffenrock, the background for the single bar litzen on officers for Gren-Rgt. Nr. 7 is lemon yellow

In pre-war regulation.

Also the picture you have shown above is Prinz Oskar wearing the M1915 feldbluse

I posted two photos. If the other one, with the tunic, does not show, let me know.

The table you have shown above is for enlisted waffenrocks

Applies for both officers and enlisted; if white for enlisted, silver for officers, as if yellow for enlisted, gold for officers.

nother incorrect item I noted was the red piping you have painted around the Brandenburg cuff area (the narrow vertical piece where the litzen is attached), which would be incorrect for the Prussian grenadiers and guard grenadiers, which had no piping on that area.

Take a look at this high definition photo of Prinz Oskar:

Now, a closer look at the brandenburg cuffs:

See the pipping on horizontal and vertical panel?

Finally, Dave, as a historian, i preffer to rely on photographic evidence, more than on regulation. Especially when it comes to german royalties, who often had "non regulation" uniforms and insignia. Want a example of that? Take a look at this photo of Kronprinz Wilhelm:

The tunic he is using, with four pockets, on regulation, does not exist! It was private taillored based on the wurttemberg ski troops tunic.

But, can you discuss with the photo?

Regards

Filipe

 

[dave mosher]

Filipe

As I stated before, yellow in monochrome photos is very dark. All M1910 officer litzen was muted metallic gray, never "gold". If you look at the Brandenburg cuff you have shown above, there is no piping around the vertical portion of the cuff with the litzen. The remainder of the cuff is piped red, including the bottom edge. Now looking at the Crown Prince, he is wearing a private purchase M1915 feldbluse with pockets. As you stated, it was not regulation but many officers in all of the branches had pockets put on their private purchase tunics. Of note, he is also wearing his M1910 riding breeches for hussars, which have a muted feldgrau silk braid up the side of the seams and crosses over the butt area. He is also wearing his M1915 officer schirmmutze for the 1. Leib-Husar Rgt. with a black top, red band and white piping (kurassiers, dragoons and hussars were allowed to wear their prewar color configurations for their dress caps).

 

[Filipe]

Dave

I will be honest and say that i do not have enough knowledge about color equivalences in monochrome photos, film differences, etc. Photography is something that interests me, but i do not have the time to learn more as i wish i could.

But i think that we´ve reached a fair point here. Your observations, without a doubt, have great value and can be used by other painters who see this thread. But i remain behind my research for Uli, and i think that is, at least, plausible (as i said in our private conversation).

Your observations about the Kronpriz photo add more depth to what i said about the royalties uniforms. By the way, did you noticed that in the Oskar photo above, he is wearing a french bayonet?

Finally, i thank you for your kindness and politeness in your messages, here and in private, where i hope we can continue our exchange of ideas.

Regards Dave

Filipe from Brazil