question for the oil guys
- Thread starter samson
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Manos
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Mar 3, 2014
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It depends mate. You should try them both to see if you're happy with the result. there's no right or wrong. Some oils are transparent enough, so you're gonna need some base paint of the same shade as the colour that you would use later. Hope this helps. Enamel base colour (such as the matt Humbrol's) also produce excellent results. Experiment yourself.
M
M
Mike S.
A Fixture
I always use an acrylic color undercoat over primer for each major color used on the figure.
Piotr Gonczarek
Well-Known Member
Hi Samson,
I think its best to paint over acrylic base. Its also hepful to put few thinner acrylic coats on figure first -it helps to "fight"this sometimes awful transparency of oils. For flesh , its good to do red brown vallejo primer , then dark brown small amounts of achre yellow and little white all mixed (this is what Danilo Cartacci recommends and it really worked for me). Oils are great to experiment. Sometimes frustrating , but so easy to repair mistakes.
Happy painting !
Cheers,Peter
I think its best to paint over acrylic base. Its also hepful to put few thinner acrylic coats on figure first -it helps to "fight"this sometimes awful transparency of oils. For flesh , its good to do red brown vallejo primer , then dark brown small amounts of achre yellow and little white all mixed (this is what Danilo Cartacci recommends and it really worked for me). Oils are great to experiment. Sometimes frustrating , but so easy to repair mistakes.
Happy painting !
Cheers,Peter
Ulrich
A Fixture
Can only agree with the others. I always use a primer or/and acrylic as a base. And I think the oil colour dry better on that base
If you undepaint with oils, there is a high risk that you will apply a too thick layer of paint since you are a beginner. Oils should be applied in very very small amounts and spread spread spread as much as you can.
Oils can be messy since they will not dry instantly.
Also, acrylics are also very forgiving. Since they dry in seconds, you can erase what you have just done with another color.
Why not try 100% acrylics at first since you will have to buybthem anyway for the undepainting?
alex
Oils can be messy since they will not dry instantly.
Also, acrylics are also very forgiving. Since they dry in seconds, you can erase what you have just done with another color.
Why not try 100% acrylics at first since you will have to buybthem anyway for the undepainting?
alex
kagemusha
A Fixture
If your having to 'fight this sometimes awful transparency of oils'.....then you are missing the point of them....it is their transparency that makes them unique....
To fully appreciate oils...first you will have to learn the simple fact that 'less is more'....they have a steep but rewarding learning curve...and...once mastered....have a plethora of uses that no other single medium can match.
This may give you an insight into several ways and techniques they can be applied to.....
http://www.planetfigure.com/threads/my-way-with-oils.52194/
Ron
To fully appreciate oils...first you will have to learn the simple fact that 'less is more'....they have a steep but rewarding learning curve...and...once mastered....have a plethora of uses that no other single medium can match.
This may give you an insight into several ways and techniques they can be applied to.....
http://www.planetfigure.com/threads/my-way-with-oils.52194/
Ron
Piotr Gonczarek
Well-Known Member
Im NOT missing the point.
There are many ways to use oils to your advantage. One school is many small amounts of this layers , another is less coats but thicker , and for that you need strong multi layered acrylic base. It has nothing to do with oil "uniqueness",simply yout preferred way to approach their consistency. And there are other strategies and preferences as well. That you prefer one in particular, doesnt mean that my approach is any more wrong. Its the results that count.
kagemusha
A Fixture
No need to SHOUT!.....I would suggest you re-read my post.....because I can find no criticism of you or your methods within it....simply because I know nothing about you...nor you me.
I would suggest you could have used a less harsh word than 'awful'....as if I were a newcomer to oils...I would be put off trying them..believing them to be harder to work with than they are.
I posted a link to one of the ways I personally work with oils....with the sole intention of helping said newcomer....why don't you do similar....instead of using a 'named' painter to support YOUR view.
Ron
I would suggest you could have used a less harsh word than 'awful'....as if I were a newcomer to oils...I would be put off trying them..believing them to be harder to work with than they are.
I posted a link to one of the ways I personally work with oils....with the sole intention of helping said newcomer....why don't you do similar....instead of using a 'named' painter to support YOUR view.
Ron
Paul Kernan
A Fixture
I prefer an acrylic or even enamel (Humbrol) undercoat over the primer. However, some (Jim Johnston) obtain beautiful results by applying oils directly over their primer coat. I've tried this before unsuccessfully. Regardless its important you apply the primer in a series of thin mist coats rather than one heavy spray. This will result in a smooth finish that still maintains enough 'bite' for either your undercoat or top coat.
Piotr makes some good points but I'm also a believer in using oils as a stain rather than a heavy coat. Just enough to attain the right tone and allow for subsequent blending of your shadow and highlights. Too heavy a layer will in most cases result in more of shiny finish (I use a heat box everytime regardless). And don't cheap out on poorer quality oil paints. Stick with W&N artists, Sennelier, Old Rembrandt. Easier to work with, better finish and so less frustraing. The initial cost outlay may seem expensive but it will still save you in the long run. You won't be binning a tube because its too oily or lacks opacity. I still have a couple of tubes that are hitting the 10 year mark.
Best of luck
Paul
Piotr makes some good points but I'm also a believer in using oils as a stain rather than a heavy coat. Just enough to attain the right tone and allow for subsequent blending of your shadow and highlights. Too heavy a layer will in most cases result in more of shiny finish (I use a heat box everytime regardless). And don't cheap out on poorer quality oil paints. Stick with W&N artists, Sennelier, Old Rembrandt. Easier to work with, better finish and so less frustraing. The initial cost outlay may seem expensive but it will still save you in the long run. You won't be binning a tube because its too oily or lacks opacity. I still have a couple of tubes that are hitting the 10 year mark.
Best of luck
Paul
Piotr Gonczarek
Well-Known Member
1.No shouting - simply underlining the fact im not missing anything.
2.If I think theyre transparency can be sometimes i awful and frustrating -I will write it. Im not the only one to think so either.
3.I have no problem whatsoever with your link.
4. "Named"painters are usually full of good advice, thx to their experience. If I want to quote Cartacci, I will .If you dont want to do that, but prefer posting links, I have no problem with that.But dont tell ME what to do or not to do.
Piotr Gonczarek
Well-Known Member
PAnd don't cheap out on poorer quality oil paints. Stick with W&N artists, Sennelier, Old Rembrandt.
Best of luck
Paul
Agree wholeheartedly, Paul!
Cheers,Peter
kagemusha
A Fixture
Obviously English is not your first language....so let me make this simple for you....at no point in my post did I 'tell' you what...or not...to do.
I made suggestions based on how you 'came across'...as to how it could have been worded less harshly.
You might want to look up the meaning of the word 'petulant'.
Ron
I made suggestions based on how you 'came across'...as to how it could have been worded less harshly.
You might want to look up the meaning of the word 'petulant'.
Ron
Piotr Gonczarek
Well-Known Member
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kagemusha
A Fixture
Best idea you will ever have
