Us "Corporal Jones " type painters.

[Bluebottle]

Here's my query . 30 years ago I could split a human hair without glasses with a scalpel.
Now I need glasses to find my scalpel.

Returning to painting after 20+ years I look back at my collection and now realise how good I was.
But now it's harder. If I even sit in one position for 30 min painting I set like a fresh cast resin figure.
I get so fed up of changing glasses every 10 seconds ...no I don't like bi vocals or variables that much.
And why is it that in my 30's I had infinite patience but now want a figure painted in a day !
30 years ago I sat for hours on a broken wooden piano stool to paint. Now I have bought and modified a luxury memory foam office chair and it feels like I'm sat on a pile of house bricks.

30 years ago there were just books , few and far between for reliable good info ..but why do they seem better than the flood of on line info ?

I used to buy a figure and couldn't wait to see it painted up. Occasionally I would see one painted up at a show which spoiled my anticipation. Now, I buy a figure and can instantly see dozens on line already painted up in various ways ....it almost dampens your vigour to paint said figure as it's "already there ".

yes, I sound like Victor Meldrew ...I AM Victor Meldrew . But I'm finding returning to figure painting harder than I anticipated . Still love every atom of it but actually doing it now ? I honestly don't think I'll achieve what I did 30 years ago. I'm wondering if or not to accept a more basic painting technique now ? Less ultra perfection ?
one last thing and this is the worst , before it was a collection for life ... now it's just a few decades more. I know that's miserable ..but isn't it true for us pensioneers ? It's a shadow that I can't get rid of.

well , I thought it might be good to hear other Corporal Joneses and their thoughts too .

 

[Blind Pew]

Hmm. I'm 52, and I reckon I might be one of the youngest on here. I want to be proved wrong. It is a fear I have. Especially looking around at the last model show I attended; some of the participants were a generation older than I am. Just about my only worry about this hobby is that it might die out.
For loadsa stuff I've done fairly recently, I've struggled to find a painted example of one; this is not something I mind, as I can often cherry-pick from other's work and find bits I might like to replicate.
My enthusiasm is as strong as ever.

 

[Bluebottle]

I too wonder about petering out of hobby with younger generations. But I guess it's the same for ship building hobbies and other miniature work. There's used to be 3-4 big model shops in town. Now there's half an aisle at Hobby's R us . There again there's e bay etc. If only there were both ? But when people cannot see stuff eye to model I wonder ? It was seeing actual models that got me going. You don't come across models so much now on public display although when I have seen them they seem to attract interest.
I hasten to add that my comments are only my own opinion !

 

[VerSacrum]

Hmm. I'm 52, and I reckon I might be one of the youngest on here. I want to be proved wrong. It is a fear I have. Especially looking around at the last model show I attended; some of the participants were a generation older than I am. Just about my only worry about this hobby is that it might die out.
For loadsa stuff I've done fairly recently, I've struggled to find a painted example of one; this is not something I mind, as I can often cherry-pick from other's work and find bits I might like to replicate.
My enthusiasm is as strong as ever.

I'm 38 and started with 36. There are a lot of young people (Gen Z/Millennials) who paint figures but more in the fantasy/sci fi genre and they stick to YouTube, Instagram, TikTok and Reddit rather than classic forums like PF.

 

[theBaron]

The hobby is not dying, but tastes are changing. That is, more people enter the hobby-painting miniature figures-via fantasy/sci-fi and wargaming, than as fans of Napoleonic hussars (I'm 60 and I don't much care for Napoleonic hussars, either). We see the two groups, historical and fantasy wargames, reaching out to each other more and more, and exchanging ideas, tips, opinions. The established shows see more participation from fantasy fans, even as they have their own shows that are every bit as popular as the historical miniature shows. The skills needed to paint figures in both subjects are the same, and even the paints, even if "brown" is "leather" from a source catering to historical painters, and "Dwarf Poop" to fantasy fans.

And we who run the clubs and the shows take active steps to encourage those exchanges, that contact.

And if younger hobbyists prefer other media than forums, well, that, too, is just a change, not a sign that the hobby is dying.

The same kind of development takes place in scale modeling, and the crotchety old white guys of Hyperscale gretz about how the hobby is dying, because only 5 new P-51D kits came out this year, and they were hoping to pick apart 6. There are new people picking up scale modeling, but they have different tastes, they use other media than that forum (which I really think is steam-powered), and those old-timers have no idea.

As far as bricks-and-mortar locations go, and aisles of products in stores, that there are fewer kits in stores isn't a sign that the hobby is dying, it's more the effect of online sales and lower costs compared to having to maintain a bricks-and-mortar location compared to selling online.

In many ways, we're in a golden age, when we look at what is available, how many people around the world paint figures (and build models), just perhaps not necessary all the same subjects our segment has done for a few decades.

The bottle of thinner is half-full, not half-empty, in my view.

Prost!
Brad

 

[NigelR]

Like Brad said, the hobby is healthier than it's ever been, it's just it is changing. There are specialist model shops in most large towns which sell a wide range of models, paints, brushes and even show you how to build and paint the models. It's just that it's Warhammer/40K, not historical models. The company that produces the Warhammer range is a hugely successful global operation that dwarfs the likes of Airfix/Hornby, Tamiya et al. Fantasy modelling in general is more popular with younger people and is overtaking historical modelling. That's because our generation grew up in a country where the memories of WWII were still very real (war films on the TV every Sunday) so we wanted to build Spitfires and a lot of us got interested in military history as a result. Younger people today have grown up with Marvel films, sci-fi and fantasy, so that interests a lot of them more than historical stuff.

Despite that, the quality and range of historical models in all scales and media is light years ahead of what we had in the past. Certainly more than enough to keep me going for the remainder of my modelling life (I am 67.....).

If you want to look at models in shows, there are far more model shows now compared to when I was younger. They are all over the UK. Some of them attract good numbers of the general public. I exhibited at a new show this year at the NEC, Model World Live, which was a combined modelling and model railway show. There were a lot of members of the general public there and we were deluged all day with questions about the models we had on display (I was on the IPMS Great War SIG display). I'd encourage you to get out and about and talk to other modellers, it will help you get back into things.

Regarding returning to the hobby as an older modeller, I share a lot of your challenges. The eyesight and the fine motor skills just aren't there. I recently saw an old wargames figure I had painted about 30 years ago. I had painted all the lettering on a 25mm French Napoleonic standard without the aid of glasses and it was perfectly legible. I simply could not do that today even with glasses and an optivisor. You just have to accept that and embrace it and try to be the best you can. I try to learn and improve each time I work on a project.

I agree with what you say about seeing so many figures painted online. It can be off-putting, especially as there are now many professional modellers and figure painters posting their work everywhere. I too have had that loss of excitement about a figure when I realise I can't paint it as well as the people that have already posted it on Facebook. I must admit that I am focusing more on dioramas and vignettes rather than single figures partly because I like to create something unique. It also means I don't have to compare my figure painting directly with people who are much better than me.......

I would say don't be discouraged. Have fun, enjoy getting back into figure painting. Go to some shows and chat to people. And my advice is stay off Facebook and the like and stick with the nice people on Planet Figure. I have had a lot of help and advice from people here and it has really helped me.

 

[NigelR]

I get so fed up of changing glasses every 10 seconds ...no I don't like bi vocals or variables that much.

My advice - get an Optivisor and/or Vision Aid. That will save you having to change glasses. Get your glasses optimised for most close up work (so reading glasses) and then use the Optivisor/Vision Aid for detail painting. You can just flip the Optovisor/Vision Aid out of the way when you don't need it.

I tend to do clean up, assembly and basecoating using glasses but when I start painting I use the Optivisor/Vision Aid most of the time. This makes up for the fact that even with glasses I cannot see enough detail to properly paint things like eyes.

I started with an Optivisor but also have a Vision Aid which I tend to use more as I find it lighter to wear. Both have strengths and weaknesses, check them out and see which might appeal to you.

 

[yellowcat]

Yes, we are all getting old and our eyesight is getting worse and not to mention cataract is also creeping on you. When doing close up work I can see better without my bifocal but sometimes I use an optivisor for fine detail work.

I built my first plastic model kit when I was five or six years old and I painted my first white metal kit back in the late seventies. Back then it was consider as the first golden age of figure modelling. I was spoiled with figure kits from Poste Miltiaire, Almond, David Grieve, Chota Sahib, Stadden, Phoenix and Le Cimier just to name a few. They were perfectly sculpted and cast in white metal and they were mostly historical subjects.

Fast forward at present, which some consider as second golden age of figure modelling.
From all the figure shows around the world, I noticed all the attendees were mostly old folks like me. There are more fantasy figures than historical ones on exhibit and entry. I observed from all these shows there is a trend where fantasy figures and busts are painted in 2d illustration style with the same techniques and colours that were once practiced from the late 70s to early 90s and display them with a painted backdrop by using different premixed acrylic paint sets that are available from various manufactures.

With resin kits, 3d sculpting, 3d printing and Stl files dominate the figure kit market these days and white metal kits are diminishing. For resin kits, most of them are great but some of the sculpting and casting are not up to standard e.g. problems with anatomy, off set mould lines, misalignment parts, cheap resin, thin rein, big chunks of pour stubs, missing casting part, sticky resin and bad customer service that needed to cope with.

For 3d sculpting and 3d printing most of the time the preview from some figure producer promoting their 3d kit, it looks fantastic on the monitor screen but it is not what you get in the real kit. Often, the 3d sculptors pack in so many minute details onto their sculpture but when it is printed the details become soft and almost disappear.
I am not a fan of the 3d printed kits. They are mostly printed hollow to reduce cost. The resin parts are thin, brittle and fragile especially for the weapons and horse reins. 3d hollow figures may collapse under heat. Back in the days a bust is a bust but nowadays due to 3D sculpting, a full figure can easily be “chopped off” the lower body and becomes a half figure which is presented as a bust. I have received some 3d kits which I needed to re-wash them in IPA again to remove any sticky uncured resin ….and then there are all these pirated Stl files and kits printed from these files which are infested on the internet. Hand held 3d scanner is getting cheaper these days which make it easier to scan an existing figure and “doctor” them into some other post. It is even worst than recasting 10 to 15 years ago. To me, I regard this is the golden age of figure pirating.

 

[NRG]

It seems Yellowcat has had a bad experience with 3d printed models. I must say my experience has been positive. I have bought 3d printed busts from El Greco, Scale Collectables and Forge of History and have been delighted with my purchases. The quality of the printing , the detail and the finish have been exceptional. All were almost ready for painting straight from the box.
Perhaps, like in everything else, one has to be careful and only buy from reputable producers. Yellowcat is right of course in that there are many cowboys out there on the internet who from their feedback clearly sell sub standard products (poor quality printing, resin that hasn’t set, broken parts etc).
But don’t think it’s appropriate to tar all 3d producers with the same brush.

 

[yellowcat]

It seems Yellowcat has had a bad experience with 3d printed models. I must say my experience has been positive. I have bought 3d printed busts from El Greco, Scale Collectables and Forge of History and have been delighted with my purchases. The quality of the printing , the detail and the finish have been exceptional. All were almost ready for painting straight from the box.
Perhaps, like in everything else, one has to be careful and only buy from reputable producers. Yellowcat is right of course in that there are many cowboys out there on the internet who from their feedback clearly sell sub standard products (poor quality printing, resin that hasn’t set, broken parts etc).
But don’t think it’s appropriate to tar all 3d producers with the same brush.

I have bought from El Greco before. Their 3d print is great but some parts were thin and brittle. That is the nature for 3d resin. Good luck if you paint your 3d print straight out of the box. Have you ever re-wash your 3d printed kit in IPA? You will be surprise the amount of residue that leaves behind after the wash. I also clean mine in an ultrasonic cleaner. I did not tar all 3d producers with the same brush as you have indicated and do not put words in my mouth. I have bought from reputable sculptors and producers.
Check out my figure review on El Greco 3d printed Ronin bust: https://www.planetfigure.com/threads/ronin-3d-bust-by-hellbender-museum.504087/

 

[Martin64]

Briefly I don't worry too much about my hobby "dying". You will find numerous threads about that topic on this forum and we are still alive and kicking. The average age of historical figure modellers has risen but that is not surprising because we were bitten by the bug when the hobby offered almost exclusivly historical themes. We have seen the great times when the quality and variety of figures went beyond anything that could be imagined when I opened my first box of Airfix figures and there is still more to be expected. So get over the problems of age with the help of optivisors and nice chairs etc. and carry on.
Cheers Martin

 

[Nap]

Hi Bluebottle

All responses are great answers and thoughts , for me it’s optivisor , I also have a glasses type one with a choice of clip in lens in various magnification...and it’s got lights ...look on Amazon

As for the hobby, technology has brought its benefits so embrace it if you wish , there are so many models out there all by skilled artists wether traditional or 3D so go for what you want

Treat yourself to a good comfortable chair and a light

......as Frankie Goes to Hollywood said ....”the world is our oyster”

Look forward to seeing your benchtime

Nap

 

[Warren SMITH]

I'm confident the hobby will be around long after I've kicked the bucket.. I've certainly enjoyed my time with it so far.. The rise of resin and now 3d sculpting brought new people to the hobby over the years and I feel the younger ones will always filter in to bolster the ranks.
I lived through the " Golden years " when the Aussie dollar was strong against the pound and green back and my stash grew considerably during that time..
I limit what I buy these days due to lack of space for storage and display.. Postage cost doesnt help either.. More than the cost of the figure..
Its good to see more and more vehicles coming out in larger scales, 1/16 seems to be having a huge boost and figures are being created to man them.. Much easier to see than 1/35 these days..
As stated in previous threads, I will enjoy my hobby while I'm here as my kids/grandkids wont take up the hobby..
These days I'm more worried that I wont get to witness England win a major football trophy in my life time, seeing I was born the year they won their first and only world cup.

Smithy.

 

[Ray Stout]

Sounds like we're arguing for a sperate Veterans Class in competitions, less motor skills, fading eyesight etc. I've been in this hobby since 1973 and I'm now 76yrs. old and loving every bit of the hobby. One thing I've tried to do to make my figs. seem different is what I call Animations. I'm not good enough to do full conversions so, if I can change an arm, or a stance, e.g. Take an almond fig. Gothic Knight, and a Hinchcliffe Gothic Knight and saw them apart at the waist. You now have 2 different figs which are unique to me. This hobby isn't just about painting, it's always been about creating something.

 

[WarhammerAdjacent]

I’m another younger member of the community (39 this week) and I agree with much of what has been said about the hobby changing rather than dying. People communicate through different means - fora are dying but there are countless instagram accounts about figure and miniature painting. Young people tend not to use Facebook so much so it tends to be millennials and older on there, other SM has a solid presence.

I do wonder about shows though, I sometimes go to a local club (white rose) and they are ace, very welcoming although I’m sure there’s always more we could do to reach people. When I’ve been to bigger regional shows though I’ve not found them hugely welcoming or engaging. It’s nice to see what’s on display and hunt for a bargain, I occasionally bump into someone I know which is great, but they still feel cliquey. The number of stall holders I’ve encountered who were so busy chatting to a mate that they ignore people trying to buy stuff or ask questions about products. It reminds me vaguely of my local model shop as a kid, every week I’d take my pocket money on the bus to pick up a new kit. The manager was always chatting to his mate who ran the shop next door. One day I asked if he could help me with something, he was utterly dismissive and frankly quite rude. I put down my planned purchase and never went back.

I’m not saying everyone is like that, but t think this experience of the hobby is probably quite common among young people. The difference is that 20 years ago all we had was physical shops and communities, now they can meet and buy online. If ‘our’ spaces aren’t welcoming and engaging they have their own. If the youngsters aren’t in our spaces (and heard) we will become increasingly inward looking which I suspect is where the ‘hobby is dying’ stuff comes from. It’s fine really, because other spaces are growing and things are changing, but if we want our space to continue too we need to adapt. If we want our favourite traders to continue in business then we need to help others see them and help them to hear what those who make up the future of the hobby want.

Sorry, that turned into a bit of a ramble. I suppose the tl;dr is change us fine, shows and shops aren’t always welcoming, if we want to protect our space we need young voices.