Using oil paint on figures / busts..... a dying art?

[samson]

I was told this in a local hobby shop . Can someone explain to me the big move toward acrylic . When i get back to painting i plan on using acrylic as a base and oil over it for shadows and highlights etc . At least on historical pieces .

 

[theBaron]

I wouldn't say that painting with oils is a dying art. But many do find acrylics easier to work with, especially that they dry much faster, so you can work faster.

I have used acrylics and oils as you describe, though I have been moving more towards using acrylics for base colors and for highlighting and shading. But I think it's actually trickier to highlight and shade with acrylics, than with oils.

Prost!
Brad

 

[megroot]

I started with acrylic but couldn't get away with the paint.
Then i go with oils over the acrylic and it worked.
Now and then I think I'm gonna back to acrylic but every time i have no guts to do it.

Marc

 

[Red Five]

I jumped to acrylics from oils a few months ago.

I find I can get finer detail.

Andrew

 

[polyphemus]

Figures don't have to be painted exclusively in oils or acrylics. Play to the strengths of both for different areas of the piece.

Geoff

 

[Nap]

I use both Acrylics and Oils ....Water soluable ones .....best of both worlds

I don't believe oils are dying out ...they are the choice of many great artists including those in our miniature world

Every medium is usable .

Nap

 

[MCPWilk]

I use acrylics, enamels and oils.

Mike

 

[sippog]

I use and have used at some point pretty well everything that can be used - including acrylics, water colours, gouache, enamels, oils, inks, dyes, waxes, polishes and pastels. I remember the early days when people swapped tips about using nail varnish on their Citadel orcs and wizards!

Totally agree that the medium you use should be the best way of achieving what you want but part of the pleasure I get from the hobby is also trying out new things. Today, for example, I found a new range of alcohol based inks that I'm dying to have a go at putting through my airbrush.

I'm always 'wasting' money on new paints and new gear; one of the reasons, my wife claims, that we live in penury instead of in a big house with a swimming pool.

 

[Jay-BFG]

Never got on with acrylic, used it as a base coat for oils, but have just moved onto enamels as a base coat.
Experimenting with gouache at the moment as well

 

[JasonB]

I'm an oils guy and always will be. I use acrylics for undercoats, and sometime for the final coat, but for flesh and anything that needs smooth transitions, oils can't be beat. I recall about 15 (or more?) years ago or so when acrylics really started to be more widely used, and there were some real artists that could use them them and emulate pretty well what could be done with oils, and I think at that time, that was their goal. There are some real artists using acrylics today that are amazing. As Acrylics caught on and more and more people used them, but with less oil-like results, I think we saw a style shift from attempting to emulate oils (and enamels to an extent), to a style where blending and smooth transitions weren't the ultimate goal. A sort of "highlight, middle and shadow" style, with layers in between, but without real blending, became normal. Hard lines around pockets, hard shadows and solid lines of highlight, became...accepted, for the want of a better word. I know there are all kinds of styles and ways to achieved desired effects, but I think what it came down to was that once that style caught on, then many folks didn't see the need for the advantages of oils, and went for the quicker drying time of acrylics. I don't consider acrylics easier in any way to achieve the effect that I am going for (smooth transitions, a more natural sheen on flesh) and they frustrate me to no end. If the drying time of oils is too much for you, there are ways to speed them up. Or work on patience and learn the fine art of working on multiple figs at the same time!

 

[sippog]

.... As Acrylics caught on and more and more people used them, but with less oil-like results, I think we saw a style shift from attempting to emulate oils (and enamels to an extent), to a style where blending and smooth transitions weren't the ultimate goal. A sort of "highlight, middle and shadow" style, with layers in between, but without real blending, became normal. Hard lines around pockets, hard shadows and solid lines of highlight, became...accepted, for the want of a better word.

I'd agree with this up to a point but I think it's more a case of a certain painting style becoming popular: high contrast, sharp detailed, almost 'cartoony' which I associate with fantasy subjects. If the figures you paint are mainly 32mm, 54mm or 75mm then this works very well but I've noticed it occurring with all scales of figures and becoming a dominant style at competitions (it doesn't hurt that it photographs well too).

On the other hand, there are painters (Alfonso Giraldes and his 'f***k smoothness' approach, Kirill Kanaev with his stipple blending) who are trying to create for-want-of-a-better-phrase 'oil paint effects' with acrylics. I often find myself intending to use oils - mainly because I like to explore new techniques - but ending up using acrylics; partly because I know them better and partly because the use of mediums (retarders, blenders, matte medium etc), plus an airbrush, allows me to get the effects I was looking for without oils.

I also don't think the drying time of oils is the issue so much as the problem of switching easily between oil based and water based paints. At least that's the issue for me, I always feel I need to get all my acrylic painting done first before I can switch over.

 

[fogie]

Dying art ? I really don't think so.

I am a hide bound oils painter - moreover one of those who prefers to mix whatever is needed from a basic palette of just
five colours. I could waffle on about its blendability, the ease of dry brushing, and the importance of desaturating the tones,
blah ! blah ! But all this can also be achieved with acrylics. One sort of paint isn't essentially better than the other - each
requires its own different set of techniques which have to be mastered.

It's just a matter of preference.

 

[ghamilt1]

Having read some of the comments in this fine thread, I have a few questions. When people are talking about acrylics, are they referring exclusively to hobby acrylics like Vallejo, or are they talking about artists quality acrylics like "Golden" or other professional "artists" acrylics? I didn't think one could use extenders, and other acrylic mediums with hobby acrylics. If you can use artist's acrylics, I may have to rethink my approach!

Personally, I use oils over hobby acrylics like many here have already said. Mostly because it works for me and makes me happy with the result. I sometimes wonder about the time advantage of using acrylics. Yes they do dry faster, but that is off set by the number of layers required to get that "smooth" transition. But I think ultimately we all choose the medium that produces the best result in our eyes as painters.

 

[samson]

Thanks all for the thoughts and opinions . I wont go on about it but have been nagged by back problems the result being a t fusion of the lower back the most recent pain spell resulted in a mri and the realization of needing a new hip which will happen in the next month so i am thinking the oil over acrylic approach with the slow drying time of the oils might be beneficial to me as you can see in the below pic of what i had started a while back ( since has been stripped ) and awaiting primer LOL I think there is way to much paint on her LOL

Having read some of the comments in this fine thread, I have a few questions. When people are talking about acrylics, are they referring exclusively to hobby acrylics like Vallejo, or are they talking about artists quality acrylics like "Golden" or other professional "artists" acrylics? I didn't think one could use extenders, and other acrylic mediums with hobby acrylics. If you can use artist's acrylics, I may have to rethink my approach!

Personally, I use oils over hobby acrylics like many here have already said. Mostly because it works for me and makes me happy with the result. I sometimes wonder about the time advantage of using acrylics. Yes they do dry faster, but that is off set by the number of layers required to get that "smooth" transition. But I think ultimately we all choose the medium that produces the best result in our eyes as painters.

they wanted to sell me retarders and such for the vallejo paint i have so you must be able to use these products with hobby paints i would guess . I may not be able to paint yet but have not stopped buying it LOL

 

[yellowcat]

As Acrylics caught on and more and more people used them, but with less oil-like results, I think we saw a style shift from attempting to emulate oils (and enamels to an extent), to a style where blending and smooth transitions weren't the ultimate goal. A sort of "highlight, middle and shadow" style, with layers in between, but without real blending, became normal. Hard lines around pockets, hard shadows and solid lines of highlight, became...accepted, for the want of a better word. I know there are all kinds of styles and ways to achieved desired effects, but I think what it came down to was that once that style caught on, then many folks didn't see the need for the advantages of oils, and went for the quicker drying time of acrylics.

This is really well said by Jason. It is just like painting by numbers without the numbers.
My undercoats, coats in between and final coat are all oil. I use enamel for metallic only.

Felix

 

[Paul Kernan]

I would have to agree that acrylics appear to hold court at most of our current shows and hobby forums. However, in his book (HIGHLY recommended) , Danillo Cartacci advises to use what works best for you to achieve the affect you are after. If that means oils so be it, same for acrylics and again for enamels. We each have our preference of medium (mine happens to be oils) but that should not mean we shy away from the alternate forms. For instance, although I am an 'oil guy', I have found acrylics are much better for modern drab uniforms. I'm not so sure one is easier than another, more likely successes are an outcome of our individual level of comfort (i.e. experience).

 

[Wayneb]

I would have to agree that acrylics appear to hold court at most of our current shows and hobby forums. However, in his book (HIGHLY recommended) , Danillo Cartacci advises to use what works best for you to achieve the affect you are after. If that means oils so be it, same for acrylics and again for enamels. We each have our preference of medium (mine happens to be oils) but that should not mean we shy away from the alternate forms. For instance, although I am an 'oil guy', I have found acrylics are much better for modern drab uniforms. I'm not so sure one is easier than another, more likely successes are an outcome of our individual level of comfort (i.e. experience).

Paul.....I think you nailed it right there....I guess it probably depends on who is behind the brush.

 

[brian]

I

I'm an oils guy and always will be. I use acrylics for undercoats, and sometime for the final coat, but for flesh and anything that needs smooth transitions, oils can't be beat. I recall about 15 (or more?) years ago or so when acrylics really started to be more widely used, and there were some real artists that could use them them and emulate pretty well what could be done with oils, and I think at that time, that was their goal. There are some real arti sts using acrylics today that are amazing. As Acrylics caught on and more and more people used them, but with less oil-like results, I think we saw a style shift from attempting to emulate oils (and enamels to an extent), to a style where blending and smooth transitions weren't the ultimate goal. A sort of "highlight, middle and shadow" style, with layers in between, but without real blending, became normal. Hard lines around pockets, hard shadows and solid lines of highlight, became...accepted, for the want of a better word. I know there are all kinds of styles and ways to achieved desired effects, but I think what it came down to was that once that style caught on, then many folks didn't see the need for the advantages of oils, and went for the quicker drying time of acrylics. I don't consider acrylics easier in any way to achieve the effect that I am going for (smooth transitions, a more natural sheen on flesh) and they frustrate me to no end. If the drying time of oils is too much for you, there are ways to speed them up. Or work on patience and learn the fine art of working on multiple figs at the same time!

I'm an oil man over enamels and have been for many moons.Im totally in agreement regarding the acrylic fantasy crossover to the historical stuff which tends to be less subtle and in some cases over the top.There are acrylic painters who produce some brilliant stuff out there,but I find that oils are more forgiving,as corrections can be made a lot easier.The advent of the airbrush is not to my liking, unless it's used as a primer,as I've seen figures mostly painted with an airbrush that would be extremely difficult to replicate in oils.
My favourite acrylic painters are the ones that make figures/busts look like they've been painted in oils.
To each his own

 

[yellowcat]

Nowadays, figure manufactures put out all those acrylic paint sets to make money. Like I said before just like painting by numbers. For example they have flesh tone set. So No 1 is for base flesh, No.2 is for shadow, No.3 is for highlight. The outcome they all look the same. You can buy couple artist acrylic paint and mix your own. It is cheaper and better quality.