Cuirassier Trumpeter 1815

[smudger1960]

I'm currently doing some research for a project I plan to undertake later in the year,it concerns the French Cuirassier Trumpeters,I'm aware that the trumpeters have different coloured tunics and facings and were devoid of the cuirass,however I came across a picture yesterday which showed the Trumpeter with the tunic and wearing the cuirass,what I'd like to know is,did some Cuirassier trumpeters wear the cuirass over their tunic or is this picture inaccurate.
The picture I've included below,the trumpeter is bottom right corner

 

[Nap]

Blimey Brian you don't waste much time

I have Rouselet plates if you need details but there is lots of stuff available

Looking forward to seeing this project progress in the new year

Nap

 

[smudger1960]

Blimey Brian you don't waste much time

I have Rouselet plates if you need details but there is lots of stuff available

Looking forward to seeing this project progress in the new year

Nap

Hi Kev

I'm basically running through in my head what I may need,I have reference material on Cuirassier but not trumpeters wearing the cuirass,I just need to know if this was historically accurate

 

[arj]

Brian,

Vol 14 - Curiassiers 1800-1815 (Histoire & Collections) has only one depiction of a trumpeter wearing a cuirass. It's the 7th, 1804-11.
So, presumably, it did happen.


Cheers,
Andrew

 

[smudger1960]

Brian,

Vol 14 - Curiassiers 1800-1815 (Histoire & Collections) has only one depiction of a trumpeter wearing a cuirass. It's the 7th, 1804-11.
So, presumably, it did happen.
View attachment 200813

Cheers,
Andrew

That's great Andrew,I have ordered this book today so I'll have a good read when it arrives,this period would have been before Waterloo,I'll keep doing the research anyway.

Thanks mate

 

[arj]

If there's been one recorded instance, then there must have been more.
Trumpeters were only human. A load of protective steel around the chest is much better than a fancy coat.

Andrew

 

[smudger1960]

If there's been one recorded instance, then there must have been more.
Trumpeters were only human. A load of protective steel around the chest is much better than a fancy coat.

Andrew

Hi Andrew,I have read some napoleonic accounts that trumpeters did wear them on campaign,it's one I'm going to think on

 

[billyturnip]

I found another, I suspect most artists omit the cuirass to depict the details of the habit.

 

[Huw63]

Hi

The 6th and 7th regimental records indicate that their trumpeters wore cuirasses in 1805 and 1806 respectively. Sources: Officers and Soldiers (as above), Les Trompettes de Cavalries., Bucquoy vol. 3 Les Cuirassiers, the plates of Rousselot.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Huw

 

[Huw63]

If there's been one recorded instance, then there must have been more.
Trumpeters were only human. A load of protective steel around the chest is much better than a fancy coat.

Andrew

To our thinking true but that's applying present thinking to the past. They came from an age when 50% died before 5 years old, life expectancy was around 40 and many fought for Napoleon for glory and riches. In their mind a trumpeter had a distinctive uniform, horse and formed an essential part of the communications system and had a musical education which could be used if they survived. So this opportunity to be special indicates that maybe they would rather have been as they were. It's always worth trying to think as they thought then and not as we do today.

Cheers

Huw

 

[smudger1960]

I found another, I suspect most artists omit the cuirass to depict the details of the habit.

View attachment 200872

Many thanks Roger,what book is this ?

 

[smudger1960]

To our thinking true but that's applying present thinking to the past. They came from an age when 50% died before 5 years old, life expectancy was around 40 and many fought for Napoleon for glory and riches. In their mind a trumpeter had a distinctive uniform, horse and formed an essential part of the communications system and had a musical education which could be used if they survived. So this opportunity to be special indicates that maybe they would rather have been as they were. It's always worth trying to think as they thought then and not as we do today.

Cheers

Huw

Many thanks for your input Huw,it's definately open to debate as to whether some did wear the cuirass on campaign,going to have to think this one through very carefully

 

[billyturnip]

Many thanks Roger,what book is this ?

You've got me there, I found it on line.

 

[ellie]

Hi Brian

Been looking through books I have on trumpeters but all art work has them with out the cuirass. but in some of the text it refers to them in use on campaign. it is in the early campaigns that they refer to 1804-06 but I think it must have been common in the later years.

Best of luck with the work mate

ian

www.elliesminiatures.com

 

[Huw63]

Hi Brian

Been looking through books I have on trumpeters but all art work has them with out the cuirass. but in some of the text it refers to them in use on campaign. it is in the early campaigns that they refer to 1804-06 but I think it must have been common in the later years.

Best of luck with the work mate

ian

www.elliesminiatures.com

Hi Ian

Please would you quote your sources as this is a particular area of study of mine. Just interested as the only references I have are of the trumpeters of the 6th and 7th regiments being issued with cuirasses in the earlier campaigns (1805-1807) i.e. the Austerlitz campaign to the treaty of Tilisit in 1807.

Secondly what leads you to think that they were worn during later campaigns? Is this just a supposition or do you have some source which mentions this? I'd be interested to know as one anomaly I've seen is an ADC in Hungarian (light cavalry) dress wearing a cuirass as portrayed by Lucien Rousselot,

Any information would be appreciated.

Cheers

Huw

 

[martin tabony]

Not as easy to play a trumpet with cuirasses on. You have tobe able to take a deep breath for most calls !

Martin

 

[Huw63]

Not as easy to play a trumpet with cuirasses on. You have tobe able to take a deep breath for most calls !

Martin

That's a very good point. From the avatar based on experience???

Cheers

Huw

 

[martin tabony]

Never a trumpeter mate, I wasn't pretty enough. I've heard some bad ones after a night in the Paxton's Head !
Martin

 

[ellie]

Hi Huw

The reference came from a very old French book which I bought in Paris a few years ago. the book was over a hundred years. But talked about them being used as protection. My French is not that good but could make that out. It looks like it was a very rare event. All the plates I have show them with out. but this does not mean that it did not happen. but that reference in that book ( Ho it was published in 1888)was just has a paragraph so not so much to go on. but my feeling is that it would have happened as they would look for some protection in the field. but I will carry on searching. A good start would be to contact the army museum in Paris or the Royal armouries they have a vast library and could hold the key to it.

Ian

www.elliesminiatures.com

 

[martin tabony]

French cuirasses are closed at the sides, so perhaps trumpeters wore a slightly larger size? I believe Cuirassier trumpeters were wearing them in 1914.

Martin