Euro 2015 - and RP Models

[mick3272]

Just to point out guys, several here seem to be assuming that the organisers make a profit. I've been told on good authority (and I've no reason to disbelieve them) that Euro barely breaks-even.

The why's and wherefores and what ifs can go forever, but I think its a myth that there are huge funds to be made from holding model shows.

So. £10.00 entrance Fee,( which I don't have a problem with) £300+ per Single table for traders, The organisers barely Breaking even, £4.80 a pint of Bitter. That just leaves the owners of the Leas Cliff Hall. They would appear to be making a good profit from it???????.
Why not find a cheaper venue, with better Hotels for the punters.
Mick

 

[Adrian Cowdry]

Darren

organising such a show is a real pain - and I would certainly believe that the organisers just about break even - the venue has to be expensive - but I would say that is the bane of the show - a cheaper venue or bigger so more traders can pay less on tables and buy more tables.

 

[Tommys War]

a cheaper venue or bigger so more traders can pay less on tables and buy more tables

But in many ways Leas Hall and Folkestone are Euro, it would be a huge gamble to move away from there. I just can't see it happening.

But, the grass isn't always greener. The BMSS is a smaller show with a much lower table cost, middle of London and everything going for it - but that has had to move to a different venue due to cost and doesn't get anywhere near the Euro Militaire number of visitors or anything like that competition.

 

[Adrian Cowdry]

Darren with BMSS is it a matter of not trying? BMSS don't really put themselves out much - they used to do the Aldershot show which was well attended - the venue got over priced they went to Guildford and that show is all but gone.

Folkstone has great views but for some punters it's a pain getting down stairs.

But should a Hornchurch or Telford kick off in Crawely or some such that was figure heavy - as the attendees grow so would the show.


Just my musings.

 

[mick3272]

Only went to BMSS in London once. I arrived a little early and as I was not a member I had to wait 10mins before I was allowed in. Whilst waiting a BMSS member arrived with 5mins to go along with his sister who was not a member. Member was allowed in but sister was told she had to wait. The member started to argue this decision and was told by Mr Jobs worth on the door rules were rules.
I spent the day in the V & A.
Mick

 

[Blind Pew]

Only went to BMSS in London once. I arrived a little early and as I was not a member I had to wait 10mins before I was allowed in. Whilst waiting a BMSS member arrived with 5mins to go along with his sister who was not a member. Member was allowed in but sister was told she had to wait. The member started to argue this decision and was told by Mr Jobs worth on the door rules were rules.
I spent the day in the V & A.
Mick

You gotta hate these kinda people. I hope he enjoyed his power trip on the door.

What a shame. Their loss mate.

 

[CGS military figures]

I must say its a superb show, having gone to the first one as a teenager and now as a trader I feel it just wouldn't be the same anywhere else. The price of tables may seem high but for such a prestigious event the returns of attending as a manufacturer after the event are fruitful. The social atmosphere is amazing and the Southcliffe was buzzing every night. It's great to chat with some of the finest over a beverage, I enjoyed it so much I couldn't stay away . I can't thank those that I met enough for really making it so enjoyable from all perspectives.
I don't attend any other shows and have no plans to as to me Euro is the pinnacle, long may it continue.

 

[Tommys War]

But should a Hornchurch or Telford kick off in Crawely or some such that was figure heavy - as the attendees grow so would the show

And if my auntie had balls she would be my uncle

I've been to many, many shows across the UK as a trader and, with the exception of Telford, I only get a 10th of the revenue of Euro at most of them and that's why I don't do them. I once went to Sutton Coldfield IPMS show and took £20. Then they came and took that £20 off me to pay for the table.

Next year I'm going to Sword and Lance in Darlington, I'm looking forward to that one, perhaps that will grow and rival Euro? Figureworld is fantastic, but it goes back to my earlier point, I love the show, but only sell a tenth of what I do at Euro.

Now Telford is a different proposition, I do well there, but it doesn't have the same social 'pull' as Euro, everyone goes their own way on the evenings and while the halls are functional they lack the character of the Leas (and believe me I know all about those stairs, I have to carry everything down them on the Friday and back up them on the Sunday).

Yes, Euro certainly has its downsides and problems but you've hit the nail on the head. There isn't currently a UK alternative, and I think that even if someone did start a figure show, it would take years and a huge financial investment to get it right - and no matter where it was there would still be complaints, whether that be the parking, access to a train station or the price of the steak pies.

Look, if someone comes up with a great alternative to Euro I'll give it a go, but I can't see it. I've been going to Euro for 5 years and this time every year the post-mortem begins. I thought it might have waned this year as there was a real buzz (certainly compared to 2014 which was disappointing), but there are positives there. Robin Buckland was far more pro-active, we're seeing a real growth in the fantasy market.

Ultimately you guys have the power, when the numbers of visitors really drops at Euro and attendances at one or more other shows increases then you'll find me there - but until then Euro (warts and all) will continue.

 

[Tommys War]

I enjoyed it so much I couldn't stay away

Understatement of the century Gra

 

[Nige]

The Southcliffe is where it all happens now Nige.

"The Southcliffe" . No matter Snad we hit the sack early anyway as we were dog tired from the night before. I don't know why they call that train the sleeper 'cause we do anything but !

 

[Nige]

But in many ways Leas Hall and Folkestone are Euro. .

Nah can't agree with that sentiment. As an example take the World Expo. Held in a different city in a different country.
Its the quality competition entries, the modellers ,the traders and ultimately the name "Euro Militaire" that makes Euro. I don't think the venue (though I do quite like it) or the third rate town has much to do with it.

P.S. Should also add that the much overlooked volunteers available in the area would be a valid reason why Euro will never move from Folkestone.

 

[brian]

Darren with BMSS is it a matter of not trying? BMSS don't really put themselves out much - they used to do the Aldershot show which was well attended - the venue got over priced they went to Guildford and that show is all but gone.

Folkstone has great views but for some punters it's a pain getting down stairs.

But should a Hornchurch or Telford kick off in Crawely or some such that was figure heavy - as the attendees grow so would the show.


Just my musings.

There's a lift. I don't see the top figure painters going to Crawley.

 

[brian]

But in many ways Leas Hall and Folkestone are Euro, it would be a huge gamble to move away from there. I just can't see it happening.

But, the grass isn't always greener. The BMSS is a smaller show with a much lower table cost, middle of London and everything going for it - but that has had to move to a different venue due to cost and doesn't get anywhere near the Euro Militaire number of visitors or anything like that competition.

I must say its a superb show, having gone to the first one as a teenager and now as a trader I feel it just wouldn't be the same anywhere else. The price of tables may seem high but for such a prestigious event the returns of attending as a manufacturer after the event are fruitful. The social atmosphere is amazing and the Southcliffe was buzzing every night. It's great to chat with some of the finest over a beverage, I enjoyed it so much I couldn't stay away . I can't thank those that I met enough for really making it so enjoyable from all perspectives.
I don't attend any other shows and have no plans to as to me Euro is the pinnacle, long may it continue.

Well said my friend.A positive outlook.

 

[brian]

And if my auntie had balls she would be my uncle

I've been to many, many shows across the UK as a trader and, with the exception of Telford, I only get a 10th of the revenue of Euro at most of them and that's why I don't do them. I once went to Sutton Coldfield IPMS show and took £20. Then they came and took that £20 off me to pay for the table.

Next year I'm going to Sword and Lance in Darlington, I'm looking forward to that one, perhaps that will grow and rival Euro? Figureworld is fantastic, but it goes back to my earlier point, I love the show, but only sell a tenth of what I do at Euro.

Now Telford is a different proposition, I do well there, but it doesn't have the same social 'pull' as Euro, everyone goes their own way on the evenings and while the halls are functional they lack the character of the Leas (and believe me I know all about those stairs, I have to carry everything down them on the Friday and back up them on the Sunday).

Yes, Euro certainly has its downsides and problems but you've hit the nail on the head. There isn't currently a UK alternative, and I think that even if someone did start a figure show, it would take years and a huge financial investment to get it right - and no matter where it was there would still be complaints, whether that be the parking, access to a train station or the price of the steak pies.

Look, if someone comes up with a great alternative to Euro I'll give it a go, but I can't see it. I've been going to Euro for 5 years and this time every year the post-mortem begins. I thought it might have waned this year as there was a real buzz (certainly compared to 2014 which was disappointing), but there are positives there. Robin Buckland was far more pro-active, we're seeing a real growth in the fantasy market.

Ultimately you guys have the power, when the numbers of visitors really drops at Euro and attendances at one or more other shows increases then you'll find me there - but until then Euro (warts and all) will continue.

I hope all you moaners are reading this.

 

[brian]

"The Southcliffe" . No matter Snad we hit the sack early anyway as we were dog tired from the night before. I don't know why they call that train the sleeper 'cause we do anything but !

I slept like a log Nige in one of these reclining chairs for about 5 hours of the 7 hour journey and got off in Glasgow feeling great.No alcohol was used to induce the sleep i got.
It was that good that i may take the sleeper both ways next year.I could sleep on the edge of a razor blade mate.

 

[davidmitchell]

Don't think Euro would be the same anywhere else, Folkestone is Euro ,it is what you make it.As for these other shows mentioned they are not figure shows and would not attract modellers from the continent or further.

 

[brian]

I don't think its been all negative Snad - I think positives have already been mentioned eg : the outstanding quality in the competition does not diminish and its a great meet to see old friends. If people are paying customers then they are only voicing an opinion on something they've just paid to view. Just because some opinions are negative doesn't mean the show is going to disappear (that'll be your glass half empty again ). Could be worse mate there's no been the usual thread on the judging.

I know that the show is not going to disappear Nige, but £10 for christs sake!!! How tight can one get?

 

[dallan]

When Brian gets on a soap box does he get on it, !! but I have to agree 100% with him (a first ) lets be positive.

Three of us from Edinburgh have traveled down to Euro for 28 years now and have always had a great time, the ever increasing rail and hotel costs haven't put us off , but it may just, dependent on available funds hinder others from going, which could be one of the reasons for the drop of numbers, another this year could be the problems at the other side of the Chanel Tunnel. we actually believe the numbers were up on last year.

£14/£10 entry fee well worth the money for what you get, £4.70 a pint, be lucky to get a half for that in Edinburgh city center,

Hotel, we go to the Clifton (Brian thinks we're snobs), slight hiccup this year due to an earlier fire in the kitchens but otherwise excellent and they haven't increased their tariff for over 4 years.

As to the cost to traders can't answer that one, I only buy not sell, and I bought as usual more than I should have, but I always do!! ( could fight Waterloo with the grey army I have!!).

The Competition entries, mind numbing in there quality, the same goes for the quality to be purchased at the Trade stands.

A little piece of History why Euro is where it is, many years ago, I was having a drink with Ray Lamb and Linn Sangster at the bar in the Elizabethan Hall in Oldham at the Northern Millionaire Show, and the main reason they gave for using Folkestone for Euro was at the time the ferries from the continent came into Folkestone Harbour which they hoped would encourage continental modellers to attend, not because of its proximity to Historex Agents or Poste Militaire.

Did we have a great time at Euro this year "Yes" are we going again "Yes" already booked for 2016.

Only downsides, didn't go to the South Cliff on the Friday night but made up on Saturday (thanks for to all) and Derek (Del) did the Bridal Waltz instead of Euro

And finally to all the volunteers who give up their spare time and effort to make the show a success "Thank You".

Davy

 

[Jazz]

Do you know something. I hear this every year. On the run up to Euro everyone is so excited about going and can't wait to meet up. Then when they get there its a great show and the standard is so good, which it always is. Then afterwards everyone moans about the entry fees, the traders fees, the lack of traders, the hotels et al. I went there last in 96. It was the same then. Folkstone do not give a damn about us modellers. It is just money in the bank for them. There have been no improvements in recent years whether it be venue or hotels. In fact prices have gone up to an unbelievable amount. Fot them its all about the profit. Why dont the powers that be move the venue to the Midlands for a change. Its central to the UK, there is more choice of quality venues and hotels in the area, and it is a more up and coming place than Folkstone which is, I'm sorry my Kentish friends, just a little tired now. It is well past time for a change. Our European and other further travelling friends can easily get to Birmingham by air or rail, and British modellers further north will have a much easier journey too. There is no excuse to keep this excellent contest of superb modellers in the South of England any longer.

 

[Nige]

I know that the show is not going to disappear Nige, but £10 for christs sake!!! How tight can one get?

Me tight - I spent a bloody fortune lol and still didn't get everything. Twasn't me who complained about the price mate. My pre booked tickets worked out at £7 each day for me and I got in 30 mins before everyone else which was a boost in a positive direction to the organisers credit.

I slept like a log Nige in one of these reclining chairs for about 5 hours of the 7 hour journey and got off in Glasgow feeling great.No alcohol was used to induce the sleep i got.

It was that good that i may take the sleeper both ways next year.I could sleep on the edge of a razor blade mate.

Usually ply ourselves with alcohol and wake with a bloody great hangover. This time we had none but slept allegedly above the squeakiest bloody wheel in the railway network . We're flying next year ....maybe....if we go of course.

Don't think Euro would be the same anywhere else, Folkestone is Euro ,it is what you make it.As for these other shows mentioned they are not figure shows and would not attract modellers from the continent or further.

Sorry Dave Folkestone is not Euro. Euro is Europes Premier Figure Modelling Show and if it was held a few miles away at a better more competitive venue with better facilities for visitors then I'm sure the continentals would still come - maybe even with their families as well.