Vultures, Crows, Magpies?

[Dan Morton]

OK - this ought to get a smile or a chuckle, if nothing else...

Anybody know where I can get 120mm vultures, crows or magpies? I only need one or two of one type - not all three! European species. One or two would give a nice touch to a diorama I'm working on.

All the best,
Dan

 

[simon1969]

LOL! Long shot I think! Have you thought about sculpting your own?

What is 200mm expressed as a ratio? Can't remember. (just trying to figure out how big they'd need to be - I need something small to get myself back into "putty pushing" )

EDIT: Obviously I meant 120mm (getting smaller all the time though!)

 

[Einion]

I can't think of one Dan, sorry.

But Simon, what is sold as 120mm is usually either 1/15 or 1/16 scale (but should be about 1/14 scale!) 200mm is roughly 1/9.

Einion

 

[simon1969]

In that case, a Magpie would be about 3cm long (in 1/16) and a Crow would be around the same size. A vulture on the other hand would be anywhere between 4 & 8cm - but unless Dan's dio is set in Spain or possibly northern Italy (or somewhere round the Black Sea) it wouldn't be strictly accurate

Not promising anything Dan, but given the fact that my other hobbies include *cringes* birdwatching and drawing/painting birds I might be able to produce something fairly reasonable (though my sculpting skills were never very advanced & I've been out of modelling for over a year!)...................always thought it might be an interesting side road to take though.

 

[Dan Morton]

Simon and Einion - Yeah, I didn't think so. Told you it would be good for a laugh.

Simon - I'm up for any challenge in sculpting, but 3 centimeters? Aiiieee! That's going to be a mighty small and uniquely shaped armature to start out. HEY - I like watching birds too! You don't have to cringe!

What birds (if any) are flesh-eating scavengers that would have been present on WWI battlefields? If you want to know more about the diorama or ask a question, give me an e-mail.

All the best,
Dan

 

[simon1969]

If we're talking western front, then you're spot on with the Crow/Magpies and you could probably add Common Buzzard - 3.5cm still though - but wingspan of 8cm (think red-tailed hawk for your side of the pond!) without it looking too out of place.
Maybe even Red Kite (4.5cm ), though that might be a little harder to pass off.
I'm assuming (for no reason other than aesthetics) that you'd be setting the dio during winter?

I have to say that the phrases "WWI battlefield" "Carrion eating birds" & "Diorama" are conjuring up some brilliant (if a little disturbing!) images - nice one

BTW, you probably wouldn't need an armature for that size. as long as you got the initial shape right I would imagine it wouldn't be too hard to carve (legs and beak could prove tricky though!)

 

[Einion]

Originally posted by simon1969+Sep 2 2005, 01:15 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (simon1969 @ Sep 2 2005, 01:15 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>...given the fact that my other hobbies include *cringes* birdwatching [/b]

Hey, I'm sure we have some right anoraks here so no cringing allowed - thank your stars your other interest isn't bus-spotting! :lol:

I've drawn and painted a few birds in my time, in fact I'm gathering references for the garden birds out back ATM. Do you know Raymond Ching and Richard Sloane? They're probably my fav two bird painters if I had to pick.

Originally posted by Dan Morton@Sep 2 2005, 07:45 PM
Simon - I'm up for any challenge in sculpting, but 3 centimeters? Aiiieee! That's going to be a mighty small and uniquely shaped armature to start out.

I've thought about making some birds (in ~1/32 scale) and the simplest idea I can come up with for an armature is just a simple loop of wire to build the body over; the wire being the basis for the legs of course. Alternatively you can form the basic body shape then drill two holes for wire for the legs.

Once the bird is firmly anchored you'd add the neck and head, then the feather detailing in layers. In 1/16 you could go some way toward a decent representation of the feathers in the tail/wings at least. The beak is the bit that strikes me as being the toughest thing to get right, carving down from a rough shape is the way to get it sharp enough I'm sure.

<!--QuoteBegin-Dan Morton@Sep 2 2005, 07:45 PM
What birds (if any) are flesh-eating scavengers that would have been present on WWI battlefields? [/quote]
Other than the ever-present rats I'm thinking ravens, I'm pretty sure I remember reading them specifically mentioned in British accounts, a WWI buff might know more but I imagine a simple search in Google would confirm. Anyway, they're certainly brazen enough to scavenge during daylight!

Einion

 

[Dan Morton]

Yes, of course! Ravens! I have read memoirs where they're mentioned!

Although the Magpies would offer more opportunity for the painter, I'd think.

And Einion - thanks for the armature idea. That was sort of what I was imagining. Wouldn't you need a wire for the main (leading edge?) bone of the wings? To me the beak and the feet would be terror! The feathers I think I could do.

All the best,
Dan

 

[Guy]

Red Lancers used to have some accessories from Actramac Diffusion and there was a pack of Ravens and a package of wolves in 120mm. I have both packages and have used them.

 

[Dan Morton]

Thanks Guy! I'll check!

All the best,
Dan

 

[Einion]

Originally posted by Dan Morton@Sep 3 2005, 12:37 AM
And Einion - thanks for the armature idea. That was sort of what I was imagining. Wouldn't you need a wire for the main (leading edge?) bone of the wings?

No prob, glad to try to help. I was imagining them standing with wings furled, spread wings would be a much greater challenge even at a fairly large scale.

I think I'd try a putty-only approach for the wings if i I had to do them, starting with a basic form from rolled putty bent to shape when nearly set or formed over a temporary support.

Einion