W & N Red Sable Miniture Brushes Replacement

[denstore]

I bought them from a local artist store. My guess is that they are available from any retailer selling Da Vinci brushes.

 

[megroot]

Thanks for the info Pedro.
Now I'm waiting for you testresults.

Marc

 

[davidmitchell]

Think I will stick with my sables , tried loads of synthetic brushes but none of them have gave the same results as pure sables.
They don't point up well or hold paint the same.

Cheers David

 

[pmfs]

Marc and David, the versàtil series from Escoda have good feedback of many artists...hope dont bending as other syntectic brushes when you deal with acrylics.
Let's wait and see what they really are and if worth the money?
Good weekend!
Cheers.
Pedro.

 

[Helm]

I use https://www.rosemaryandco.com/index.php?cPath=275_365&osCsid=2l66vdthqmll6dccb9bgqmm1r3 as I said before and this what they say re sable
Can you ship Kolinsky Sable hair to the USA?

*USA CUSTOMERS ONLY*
Over the past few months I have been under discussion with several officials from the Convention of International Trade in Endangered Species (CITES) regarding the Kolinsky Sable issues. The CITES Convention is legally binding, however national legislation is required to implement its provisions. I therefore have spoken at length with DEFRA, The UK Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs.
There are several myths about Kolinsky Sable which you should know. Firstly, Kolinsky Sable is not sable hair, in fact it comes from the species called Mustela Siberia. This misnomer was used loosely to describe the hair when manufactures 'switched' from actual Kolinsky and/or Red Sable following World War Two. The trade of this hair is listed under the provisions set out by the CITES and it listed as an Annex D under Regulation (EC) No 338/97. Data for import of Annex D species is compiled yearly by UNEP-WCMC. If the data gives rise to serious conservation concerns, inclusion of a species into Annex C or B may be considered, though this is unlikely. An Annex D listed animal is more likely to be unlisted that re-listed.
An official from DEFRA has explained to me the next meeting for the Mustela Siberia could be in May 2015, though this is not confirmed as yet. They explained that for an Annex D animal to be reviewed there must be reason to do so. I questioned whether it was worth our customers petitioning against this restriction both in the UK and overseas, of which I was told it was worth trying. I also spoke with the US Fish and Wildlife Services, who suggested a similar motion.
I would like to inform our customers, we have never purchased any hair illegally or immorally. At the time of purchasing all of the 'Kolinsky Sable' hair it was both legal and ethical. Indeed, it still is legal and ethical, though it is now under restriction in the US only. The Kolinsky Sable issue is not a problem for anywhere outside of the US.
With regard to Kolinsky Sable, we have several years worth of hair in stock. We have been trading this hair for over 35 years and have spent years researching the best quality of hair for our customers, and will continue to do so.
Our companies main objective has always been to offer high quality brushes at competitive prices and it goes without saying, I am an animal lover myself and appreciate and respect all of the natural hair that we work with.
For those artists who for their own reasons do not want to buy natural hair, which I can understand, we offer synthetic substitutes and as you will probably know the synthetic fibres are improving all the time. In good faith, we give to our customers a product which we respect and treat as though our own.
Symi Jackson LL.B
Sales and Marketing Director
May 2014

I'll stick with them myself
Steve

 

[Ron Tamburrini]

I use https://www.rosemaryandco.com/index.php?cPath=275_365&osCsid=2l66vdthqmll6dccb9bgqmm1r3 as I said before and this what they say re sable
Can you ship Kolinsky Sable hair to the USA?

*USA CUSTOMERS ONLY*
Over the past few months I have been under discussion with several officials from the Convention of International Trade in Endangered Species (CITES) regarding the Kolinsky Sable issues. The CITES Convention is legally binding, however national legislation is required to implement its provisions. I therefore have spoken at length with DEFRA, The UK Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs.
There are several myths about Kolinsky Sable which you should know. Firstly, Kolinsky Sable is not sable hair, in fact it comes from the species called Mustela Siberia. This misnomer was used loosely to describe the hair when manufactures 'switched' from actual Kolinsky and/or Red Sable following World War Two. The trade of this hair is listed under the provisions set out by the CITES and it listed as an Annex D under Regulation (EC) No 338/97. Data for import of Annex D species is compiled yearly by UNEP-WCMC. If the data gives rise to serious conservation concerns, inclusion of a species into Annex C or B may be considered, though this is unlikely. An Annex D listed animal is more likely to be unlisted that re-listed.
An official from DEFRA has explained to me the next meeting for the Mustela Siberia could be in May 2015, though this is not confirmed as yet. They explained that for an Annex D animal to be reviewed there must be reason to do so. I questioned whether it was worth our customers petitioning against this restriction both in the UK and overseas, of which I was told it was worth trying. I also spoke with the US Fish and Wildlife Services, who suggested a similar motion.
I would like to inform our customers, we have never purchased any hair illegally or immorally. At the time of purchasing all of the 'Kolinsky Sable' hair it was both legal and ethical. Indeed, it still is legal and ethical, though it is now under restriction in the US only. The Kolinsky Sable issue is not a problem for anywhere outside of the US.
With regard to Kolinsky Sable, we have several years worth of hair in stock. We have been trading this hair for over 35 years and have spent years researching the best quality of hair for our customers, and will continue to do so.
Our companies main objective has always been to offer high quality brushes at competitive prices and it goes without saying, I am an animal lover myself and appreciate and respect all of the natural hair that we work with.
For those artists who for their own reasons do not want to buy natural hair, which I can understand, we offer synthetic substitutes and as you will probably know the synthetic fibres are improving all the time. In good faith, we give to our customers a product which we respect and treat as though our own.
Symi Jackson LL.B
Sales and Marketing Director
May 2014

I'll stick with them myself
Steve

Can't buy sable but you can buy and carry a hand gun

 

[pmfs]

"I would like to inform our customers, we have never purchased any hair illegally or immorally..."

is good to hear that!

Pedro.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

On the other hand, perhaps its something we should pick up, a sixshooter would be very handy in a crowded and confined space such as the traders area at Euro Millitaire or the bar at the Southcliff?

Cheers
Janne "Hipshot" Nilsson

 

[tomifune]

Can't buy sable but you can buy and carry a hand gun

​

We need the guns to hunt Mustela Siberia so we can start making our own brushes​

​

Disclaimer: No animals were harmed or about to be harmed by the above statement. It was only meant as humor.​

​

Bob ​

 

[YellaMoon]

Can't buy sable but you can buy and carry a hand gun

True, but painting a tartan with a handgun only makes a mess.
RWD

 

[denstore]

Must say that i think the people worried about the animals have a point. But at the same time, I believe that it's concentrating on the wrong thing.
The fur industry are using so much more fur than the brush industry, that the concern here is wasted. Make sure nobody around you buy fur instead, and take good care of your brushes, and the animals will likely survive. I doubt they will get extinct because of enthusiastic modellers and artists.
Lately I have started to try different kind of synthetic brushes, and I must say they have evolved a lot in the last 10-5 years. I will probably keep using the Kolinsky brushes for detail work, but synthetics or mixed brushes for most larger work.

 

[brian]

Until somebody comes up with a synthetic brush that equals W&N series 7 I wont be changing.
This thread has been blown out of all proportion and I must admit my part in it,all started by the opinions of one member who seems to have the morals of a saint and is trying to shove his opinion down my throat.That,I don't like.
Brian

 

[Don]

Who actually cares about the sable, its a rat that lives in the country so its got a better post code than you. Keep them in cages and shave them daily to make brushes. Who cares as long as we get good brushes.
I do think some people (or one person) on here, I think he is related to a saint, would be better employed trying to stop the killing of people in Syria.
My opinion, will not lose any sleep if another sable is killed today to make brushes!

Don

 

[Colin_Fraser]

I do. And I also care about Syria. I have to assume you guys are trying to get an argument going.....again. I'm not up for it. Please read the new guidelines at http://www.planetfigure.com/threads/community-posting-guidelines.64534/. Specifically on posting to deliberately inflame others. If you don't agree with Pedro that is fine. But don't waste my time starting a flame war if you please.

Colin

 

[brian]

Don the agent provocateur!!!!
Brian

 

[Don]

Colin, I had no intention or intrest really in starting a flame war. Dont know what a "flame war" is actually.
I had just got fed up, like a few members on here of the annual Save the Sable campaign. We have had it before with a very small responce, so how often do we need to hear about the horrendous conditions sable live in, we know. Where else does he advocate his ideas, is it just on a tiny forum visited by a tine amout of the worlds population. If he was spreading the word worldwide I could listen to him.
Sorry Colin, I will keep out of it from now on!

Don

 

[brian]

You were a bit harsh in your put down of Don IMO Colin.I've known Don for many years and he's not the type of person to start a war,actually he is a very fun loving person.I think his comments were made due to frustration of listening to Pedro rabbit on, on more than one occasion about the plight of the sable.After a while it all becomes boring.Pedro has made his case for not using sable brushes, so that should be enough from him on this subject.
As a moderator I would have thought that this particular chap, with his strong views which does get people rattled, and in that case a warning should be given to him to stop going over old ground i.e. sables.
Brian

 

[theBaron]

Can't buy sable but you can buy and carry a hand gun

Well, you can use a pistol to shoot your own sable brushes, "on the hoof", as it were.

Prost!
Brad

 

[Colin_Fraser]

Not trying to be mean gents but in my limited experience as a moderator, it's far better (if you get sick of a topic) that you no longer read it or post in it. I am not one for stifling speech or locking topics unless I have to. I made that mistake a few weeks ago and there were lots of complaints. I will admit to being a bit cranky after the fallings out here over the last few weeks. I much prefer modelling to refereeing. So if I have come across harshly you have my sincere apologies. No offence intended.

Colin

 

[Jim Patrick]

On the other hand, perhaps its something we should pick up, a sixshooter would be very handy inowded and confined space such as the traders area at Euro Millitaire or the bar at the Southcliff?

Cheers
Janne "Hipshot" Nilsson

A Colt 45 would be far more effective. More ammo plus you get the "shock and awe" value. Throw some hollow point ammo into the equation and you're practically Terminator. Not sure of what the effect of saying "I'll be back" would have...

Jim Patrick